If they can do it why can't we?

[Baileygunns]

I'm moving this post into a more appropriate place to continue the discussion. There are a few of you that have allot of answers to why areas keep getting shut down and how "We" the ATV community don't come together to rally... As with anything, Money is what makes things happen. This is what another state did and it works.


The yearly registrations are the only fees you pay. The one time registration and title fee that Florida charges isn't going to pay for anything.  The registration stickers you buy in NH is just like registering your car.

This is ATV and Trail bike
http://www.nhtrails.org/uploads/2009ATVtrailBikeTrails.pdf


Registration Fees
http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/OHRV/2009_OHRV_Laws_Digest.pdf

New Hampshire Fish and Game
http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/OHRV/ohrv.htm

My point is....

If a state as small an NH can have a killer trail system 4 seasons of the year and rake in tons of money while doing it, WTF is Florida waiting for?

The registration would cover all parks. You wouldn't have to have a sticker for Croom and one for the ONF or any of them...

For those of you so up on all the meetings and legislation, where can I forward these links to? Maybe if you toss these kind of numbers on someone’s plate and they can see how profitable it is for a state to have OHRV's, more areas will open... Let’s face it, money is what makes things happen, not just showing up and asking "please".

[Baileygunns]

Nothing?

Wow.

An actual idea and someone asking where to take it and none of the Contributing/Supreme Members have anything to say?

I'm asking if an idea like this has ever been presented and/or where and how do I send this Idea? 

[Anoriginal]

Here's a thought for you...why don't you start with an actual comparison of the states we're talking about here. I'd begin with the price of property, the tax basis, the voting base and the cost to operate these areas with the addition of ATV's.

Also, while you're sitting there, figure out a way to get property owners on board with allowing ATV traffic across their property for an interlinked trail system. Finally, go ahead and convince any legislator that (since we're so well looked upon in the public eye) why it would be such a good idea (politically) for any legislator to get behind such a proposal and dedicate any of the money from ATV registration solely to ATV trails and parks.

I've been fighting this battle a long time before you decided to leave the "good life" in New Hampshire and head south. Each time you get any legislator cornered on the issue, the same question gets thrown back at you. They ask, "why should I support the ATV comminity?"  Basically, they have no good reason to do so.

We are unorganized. We infight. We break rules and laws. We're are a collective risk nightmare on public property. We cost dollars to police. We are not even a blimp on the radar when it comes to a voting base...and the list goes on.

[Baileygunns]

Jeez... I wish I had your attitude... I bet I'd get allot more done.

It sounds like you do the most whining on this site.


And why should they support the ATV community?  $$$$.  Make it profitable to support.

I'll admit, I made a mistake. I moved to Florida and now I'm stuck. You're absolutely right it's no ones fault but mine... I'm just trying to make my stay a little better. My Father taught me to leave it better than you found it...


Maybe you've fought this battle to long and have become jaded... Hey, it happens... Why don't you use your "wisdom" in a positive way and try to point some one new with some energy in the right direction instead of putting everything down... My Mother taught me if you have nothing nice to say don't say anything at all...

Get a grip or stop crying... Lead, follow or get the f*ck out of the way.

Don't come here crying when they close down another area... Isn't that what you tell every one?




Is there any one else willing to add a useful comment or shall we continue to "infight"?

[Anoriginal]

Me whining? Please. Just look back at your posts verses mine.  I am anything but jaded on the issue and if I were to stop leading (which I am) you certainly could never fill my shoes.

You are incapable.

Now then, back on the issue. Do you think you can come up with a way to make it profitable to open vast areas of valuable state owned and private owned land to ATV use? Let's hear it. There are lots of us that are trying to do it. Come to think of it, I haven't seen you at any of the meetings.  


As for me "getting a grip", let's see..you mean like participating on the Federal ORVAC for the Big Cypress? Or maybe submitting 10 pages of comments on the addition lands ORV plan in the Everglades? Or (for the past 12 years) appearing at meetings, addressig legislators, traveling to the Capital to addess the governor and fighting every step of the way to keep places open while opening new ones?  I'm sure you've done so much more.

You should think about what you post and know who you're dealing with before you cast stones. Otherwise, you look stupid.

[Baileygunns]

I showed you the links. There are other people doing it in other areas of the country. You have to look out side of the box to find a solution. Obviously what has happened thus far has not worked.


Look at the square mileage of NH and the square mileage of only the National parks in FLA... NH is small in comparison. I can't understand how it can be profitable to one and not to another. Did you read any of the literature I linked?


As far as meetings and getting involved? Have you not read any of my posts? I've been asking for a direction. I have never had to become involved before. Remember I'm from NH and they already have it made in the shade...


Don't confuse my postings... There is a difference between whining and comparison.

I'm not trying to fill shoes here either... I'm just trying to put another pair on. And to call some one you've never met incapable? Come on... How would you know? You're once again putting someone down that wants to help.

I'd love to sit and talk. I'll buy the beer and pull out a few chairs over looking the Orange groves. PM me for directions. Here's your chance to add some one to your crusade. Don't pass up the opportunity, sounds like you need all the help you can get.

[IXIswamperIXI]

this is why it doesn't work, people rather argue with each other

[Baileygunns]

I agree.

I'm looking for a dierction and away to get involed. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

[Anoriginal]

I thought you wanted to leave because it sucked so bad here?

Well, if you're staying, you can usually find all sorts of meetings and ways to get involved right here on this site. Usually in this section. In fact, just about every important deadline and meeting has been posted in this area over the past year or two.

It's a good start.

[zman03]

I commend both your efforts and encourage you guys to continue!!!!!!   I too have been actively involved here in Miami (Dade County) to get a safe and legal place to recreate. I hope to be able to join forces sorta speak with other enthusiast and strenghthen our resolve. I am confident that there is a solution that will eventually be found to this ongoing issue. 

[gearhead400]

Time, Money, and dedication is what it takes to be an activist and a good chunk of us only have one of those things and thats dedication. I do as much as I can such as sending emails and trying to stop those that shine a bad light on the atv community, but I don't have the time to take off work to make meetings nor do I have the money to make it to them right now. Anoriginal, on these forums, you annoy the hell out of me, but I definitely respect you for the time and money you've put into preserving the areas we still have available to us and for the time you spent fighting for the ones we don't have anymore. That goes for anyone that has been able to fight for the ATV community as well. You seem like someone i'd get along with real well in the real world, not the internet one, because like you, I can't give a compliment and let that person think they are above me.

I love to fight for things I'm passionate about, so as soon as my boy grows up a little more and I have a more stable job (and hopefully there are still riding areas to fight for) I'll be more involved in preserving these riding areas and hopefully involved in opening new ones.

Even in this tight economy, I'd pay $100, maybe even more, JUST for a croom pass if i knew it'd help keep it running and work toward opening more places like that. I think a lot of people would agree with that as long as there was a way they could watch how their money and spent. People already question where all the money croom makes is going and I think it's cheap to get a pass right now, even with the raised rates. A "croom" in south florida and north florida would be amazing. 150 for a years access to all three? well worth it.

I always try and point out the clubs and racing organizations when they ask "why should I help the atv community. "There are jackasses in everything, we just haven't found a way to bring enough light to the people like us I suppose.

[oAAC]

Well, some very good comments here. Some times, it takes people to get upset from the action imposed on them in order for them to begin working on the problem.
Each State may have the ATV Riders with the same concerns but the resolutions are different because of the governing state.
There are so many web sites that are for ATV Riders like ATV Clubs, Associations, Councels, Advocatcy, and so on.
When a ATV Advocate is "on the job" they spend a great deal of time researching the facts and the possible resolutions that may work.
What works well in the N. Cal area will not turn out the same in Kansas, and the same goes for Fla.
I myself spend a great deal of time and money of my own doing as much as it takes to get something that works done. Those in the Local, State, or USA Government don't always get it, so people must keep pushing to get their rights of recreation heard Louder by working harder.

Here in this area, Fla, I read of many things that have effected ATV Riders.
The MVUM is one thing that has a heavy impact on recreation. The enviromentalist are a very large group,  have lobbyist, and also support politians. They have a working budget that is greater than most municpal annual budgets.
The one task to attempt is for ALL to UNITE as one, but vote independantly for comments and appeals when thentime comes.

ATV Clubs or groups, OHV Clubs, 4 X 4 Clubs are close on their recreation, out on trails. Uniting these groups makes for a very large number. Small steps, planning, uniting will begin to get more results than it will to sit back and talk about it on any forum.
Get envolved, step up and help. Start at your local Government Offices - any friend in this area is one step closer.