Holey Land SHUT DOWN: No more places to ride in South Florida!

[Anoriginal]

If that hurt his feelings, he needs thicker skin. He missed the point from the beginning. I could care less about his feelings about what I call him or his "crew" as this post was never about him or his feelings. It's about us losing another riding area. He tried to make it about him....his bad, not mine. I'll discuss him no more.

I don't blame any "type" of ATV, just a "type" of rider. Thats it. We all know the type of rider we're talking about here. Regardless, it's done and gone. All the complaining in the world will do us no good now. What we need to focus on at this point is saving what we have left. How to make it happen is the question. We're certainly up against huge odds.

[klutchbuster400]

If that hurt his feelings, he needs thicker skin. He missed the point from the beginning. I could care less about his feelings about what I call him or his "crew" as this post was never about him or his feelings. It's about us losing another riding area. He tried to make it about him....his bad, not mine. I'll discuss him no more.

I don't blame any "type" of ATV, just a "type" of rider. Thats it. We all know the type of rider we're talking about here. Regardless, it's done and gone. All the complaining in the world will do us no good now. What we need to focus on at this point is saving what we have left. How to make it happen is the question. We're certainly up against huge odds.

Ofcourse WE know what "type" of rider is messing it up for us, but those who think we are the environmental devil dont. They believe we are all out there to kill some grass.

[leeward bound]

Holey .......

Did some one or a bunch just wake up  Take this effort off this forum and write to the FWC and see what type of positvie actions can be taken to regain this area I can tell you that the immediate answer will be nothing  But that is not how you get rulings appealed

Watch this space as they say

[rdm225]

I personally blame the piss poor leadership of the F.W.C. for letting these scumbag people litter and act like animals that I have witnessed out there.They need to control it like the big cypress. I think the tracks do more damage than atvs
Greenmachine youre right when the camps started getting vandalized by the miami slime that was the beginning of the end for atvs

[jrpro130]

Well, this is just a domino effect.  Next will be big cypress...followed by others (croom)

[Anoriginal]

You cannot blame the FWC. They had absolutely nothing to do with it. Blaming them is like blaming the fire department for an arsonist. Like I said above, it is not the FWC's responsibility to baby sit those scum bags.....and I totally agree with rdm225's description of these scum bags.

Also, the Big Cypress is a completely different story. The Holylands are controlled by the State and ORV access is controlled in the Holylands by the FWC, a state agency. The Big Cypress is a National Preserve. This means it falls under federal jurisdiction and is policed by the national park service ("NPS") and ultimately the Department of the Interior ("DOI"). The FWC patrols in the Big Cypress for the sole purpose of enforcing wildlife regulations...nothing more. ORV access is entirely up to the NPS.

I can tell you that while many folks have said there is no plan to do away with ATVs within the Big Cypress, I absolutely know differently. Granted, it's not official yet and the folks with the NPS will tell you (if you ask) that there are no plans to restrict ATV use. However, just like the overwhelming problems with ATVs in the Holylands, the Big Cypress is beginning to see the same.

Now, with the Holylands closure, more ATV pressure will be put on the Big Cypress. As a result, the Big Cypress will attract more of those same scum bags rdm225 described. The NPS will not put up with that type of activity. Why? Because the current ORV plan is a negotiated settlement reached as a result of a major lawsuit over ORV use in the Big Cypress.  Any activity contrary to this settlement or any activity that increases negative impact within the Big Cypress will be stopped because NPS is required to do so under the current ORV plan.

Now, granted, there is nothing pending to limit ATV use in the Big Cypress. However, those same people within the NPS that will tell you there is no plan to limit ATVs will be the first to tell you that, if and when the Big Cypress encounters trouble from ATVs like experienced in the Holylands, the NPS' response will be fast and all encompassing. Remember, unlike the FWC, the NPS doesn't have to jump through all of the regulatory hoops to change rules. The NPS can make restrictions at any time to "protect the national preserve".

None of the WMA's were set aside as areas to use ORV's. The Holylands included. Nothing requires the FWC/state, to do anything more than grant the general public reasonable access to these WMA's. Reasonable access can mean foot traffic only off of very few limited improved trails which, can only be utilized by registered vehicles. In fact, the vast majority of Florida's WMA's are set up this way. Something everyone should keep in mind the next time they enjoy the privilege (not the right) to ride an ATV in any WMA...or for that matter....any forest, park or preserve.

[rdm225]

Its a real shame hl is getting shut down I just wish it would of been enforced tighter with heavy fines for lawbreakers. the internet didnt help either. the last couple of times out there is was insane with people, no wonder there werent more people killed out there ,jrpro youre right cypress is next

[brocker]

I have never riden at the Holey Land but I'm sorry to see it go.  Once areas start getting closed, it becomes easier to justify closing others.  I recently rode out at Big Cypress and really enjoyed the area.  I did, however, see a few soda cans on the trail and new trails cut by trucks or buggies.  Has anybody ever contacted areas like Big Cypress about doing a clean up?  I'm new on this site, but I can tell there are many here that care enough to do this.  If nothing else it would show these places that we not only want to ride but also help keep the place clean.  Just a thought.

[cg54329]

Anoriginal you work for the FWC?    I guess its time for JETSKIZ!

[MATT1969]

i have bin saying this for years.wma,s are mainly ment to be used for hunting.over the last few years they where trying to make some more money and get nature freaks and bird watchers and who elseto start useing them.they never intended these plases to get over run with ATVs like ants .just a few months ago everybody was talking about only riding at night during hunting season.well i said it then also .THAT DONT WORK.if someone is going hunting on a WILD LIFE MAGAMNET AREa they are going to get there at 4 am at the latest.so if someone is out riding around there hunting area. they are not going to have a good hunt.atvs already have a enough people that don't like us,but when your pissing off all the huntetrs.all they are doing is putting heat on FWC about why is there hunting area being overrun so they cant evan hunt.i know most of you dont hunt,but i do.so i can see why the place got shut down.everybody tried to turn into a OHV PARK.ITS NOT.but im sure someone is going to come on here and they have a right to ride.they always do. also the buggys and tracks have bin out there 75 years and it was fine before the ATVs came along.i know this because i hunted holylands back in the 90,s .is was very nice.now go take a look.look at from google earth.this is not from the buggys and tracks .its all about the atvs.now i hunt corbet from my buggy.its only a matter of time before they shut corbet down and make it a drive in only wma.what i mean is no off roading.i heard from pbso that the wheels are already in progess.but its the same thing.we go out there get in our stands at 4 am and by 7 am i have all kinds of peoples joy riding on utvs and trucks and buggys.and then theres the kids out there tearing it up.so im sure there's enough people complaining about its only a matter of time.