Alba, their pipes, and my situation...

[Ride1Rob]

Here's my story...

Alil over a year ago I purchased an Alba full system for my YFZ. About 4-5 months after I purchased the pipe I had to rivet the front of the canister with more rivets because the originals were falling out. I had no problems with the pipe until a couple of months ago. I started noticing that my rear end cap was being pushed out of the canister. The screws were not tight but they weren't so loose that they were about to come out. I recently had some major motor mods done  and think that maybe the added backpressure had something to do with this. It got so bad that the holes were beginning to be an oval. Then the header snapped in two where it bolts up the head. I e mailed Alba and at first a guy named Paul tried to help me out. He asked me to send him pics of the pipe and I did. I also sent him pics of my bike to show him that NOTHING was ragged on. He then tells me he'd  sell me a header for $80 or another system for $325. I'm not paying over $300 for a pipe that has crapped out on me in alil over a year. I explained this him and he sent my case to the parts manager. I began receiving emails from the parts manager (Marc) and he let me know that he was looking into this for me on the 27th of last month. I had heard nothing else from him until today after I emailed him asking him if he found anything and if he wanted me to give him a call. Marc is a nice guy and seems like he's genuine. But it seems it's waste of time to send it out for him to look at it if it only carries a six month warranty. What do you guys think I should do? Here are the emails we sent to each other...

To Paul at Alba on 6/23
I have an 04 YFZ450 with your Alba full system on it. Today my header pipe snapped where it bolts onto the head. I was riding and all of a sudden the bike got loud. I knew that something had come apart and shut it off. Upon inspection, that's what I found. Is this a common problem? Also, would I be able to get another header? Thanx!

From Paul
How long have you had the pipe? Also can you take a picture of the exhaust pipe and email it to me.

 

Thank You

Paul in the internet department

800-487-3236

858-486-4380 ext 234

Email to Paul
Thanx for the rapid response! I've had the pipe for about a year now. It's been a really good pipe and I love the sound as well as the power. I checked the rest of the pipe last nite and my canister screws on the rear are basically pushing themselves horizontal out of the back of the pipe. May be from the backpressure of the motor mods that I have. How much would it run me just for the can and a header? Or do you have to sale the whole kit? Thanx again!



Also sent that same email to Cory Hove and this is his reply
Please call our parts dept. toll free so they can help you. 800 487 3236.  It is very infrequent but I have seen it happen.
 
Cory

Back to Paul
Here are the pics:
 
Pics (2196) and (2197) are where the header broke underneath the bracket.
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210878
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210879
 
Pics (2190) and (2191) are both sides of the rear canister where the end cap is being forced out from the backpressure. These screws have been found a little loose on occasion and are being forced out thus causing damage to the rear of the canister.
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210888
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210889

 
Pic (2193) is the front of the can where I had to add extra rivets because the regular ones were coming loose. Once the extra rivets were added I've had no other problems from those (This was done a few months after I got the pipe).
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210890

 
Pic (2195) is a shot of the complete cannister.
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210891

 
I threw in another pic (2207) so that you can see that my quad is not ragged on. Thanx!
http://www.uploadhouse.com/viewfile.php?id=210892


From Paul
I can sell you the header pipe for $80.00 or I could sell you a new full system for $325.00. Please let me know what you would like to do.

 

Thank You

Paul in the internet department

800-487-3236

858-486-4380 ext 234

My Reply to Paul
Paul, I've been satified with the performance of this pipe for the year that I've had it and love the sound. But to have to repurchase a new pipe every year because it won't hold up? I'm pretty sure you'd be disappointed if you were in my shoes as well. A couple of years ago a friend of mine had one of your pipes on his bike and his header cracked as well. He took it back to the dealer he purchased it from and the dealer called Alba. One of your guys at Alba told him (the dealer) something about it being an older design and you guys had come up with something better because of durability issues. You replaced his pipe with the three piece Alba and had it next dayed to the dealer. I was so impressed that I purchased one while he (the dealer) was on the phone with one of your guys via credit card. Here I am a year later, and this thing is falling apart worse than his was? You saw the pics where it's coming apart! You see that the pipe has no dings and hasn't been ragged on. You see what kind of condition my bike is in as well. If I purchase the header and ride it I may get 2 more rides out of it before the can craps completely. If I purchase another system, that'll be over $700 that I've spent in a year alone on the same pipe! That just doesn't make any sense to me. Is it because I didn't go back to the dealer and go through him that I have to pay so much? If you can tell me that this sounds right to you and if you were in my shoes, you'd be comfortable with what you're offering me I'll move on. Thankyou for your time...

Email from parts manager Marc Caravaggio
SCOTT, THE PROBLEM THAT YOU’RE EXPERIENCING WITH OUR EXHAUST SYSTEM HAS BEEN BROUGHT TO MY ATTENTION AND RAISES A CONCERN TO ME.  DO YOU HAVE THE ORIGINAL INVOICE FROM WHEN YOU PURCHASED THE EXHAUST SYSTEM FROM US?  IF SO, THERE IS AN INVOICE NUMBER ON THE TOP PORTION OF THE SHEET THAT WILL ALLOW ME TO REPRINT A COPY OF IT.  IF NOT, UNDER WHAT NAME AND ROUGHLY WHAT DATE DID YOU PURCHASE THE EXHAUST?  UNFORTUNATELY, I WILL NOT BE IN THE OFFICE FOR THE NEXT TWO DAYS BUT AS SOON AS I RETURN, I WILL BE SURE TO LOOK INTO THIS FURTHER.  I’M SORRY FOR ANY INCONVENIENCE THIS HAS CAUSED YOU AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN WORK TOGETHER TO FIND A RESOLUTION.  THANK YOU.

Marc Caravaggio

Parts Manager

Alba Action Sports

(858)486-4380 X.204

(858)679-7947 fax

Email to Marc on 6/27
Hello Marc and thankyou for looking into my problem. I purchased the pipe from a dealer by the name of Richard Owes. The shops name is Southern ATV. I don't remember the exact date when it was purchased. I think I used my debit card for the transaction. The pipe was shipped to his shop and he gave me the pipe in the box but no invoice. He also said that he had something else shipped for another customer with the pipe. If you need anything else let me know and thanx again!

After hearing nothing from Marc, I emailed him back today
Marc, just seeing if you found anything on my order info yet. Would it better if I gave you a call? Thanx!

email from Marc
SCOTT, WITHOUT HAVING AN ORIGNAL INVOICE IT’S GOING TO BE HARD TO WARRANTY.  I CAN ONLY SUGGEST THAT YOU SEND THE PIPE IN SO WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT IT AND WE’LL GO FROM THERE.  LET ME KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS.

 

Marc Caravaggio
Parts Manager
Alba Action Sports
(858)486-4380 X.204
(858)679-7947 fax

Email to Marc
So is it just the invoice that you need or the proof of date when it was bought? The pipe is the newer model Alba. From what I was told the older one was a 2 piece. You guys came out with a three piece pipe not even 2yrs ago. I'll send it in but Paul asked to see pics and I sent him detailed pics of the complete pipe as well as the damage. Sux because while I'm waiting to find out what's going to happen my bike is sitting in the garage with no pipe and this at the peak of our race season. It's going to take at least a week for you to get the pipe and I only know how long for you do your inspection. May just be a complete waste of time for me. What exactly are you inspecting to determine anything? The pipe has NO DENTS, NO DINGS, NO ABUSE ANYWHERE! If it needed to be sent in I wish Paul would have told me that a week ago at least...

Email from Marc
I NEED THE ORIGINAL INVOICE SO I CAN FIND OUT THE DATE IT WAS PURCHASED.  OUR PRODUCTS ONLY CARRY A 6 MONTH WARARNTY ON WORKMANSHIP AND MATERIALS AND IT APPEARS THAT IT FALLS OUT OF THAT 6 MONTH PERIOD.  I’M INTERESTED TO SEE THE PIPE ITSELF BECAUSE IN THE PAST WE’VE HAD CUSTOMERS TRY TO WARRANTY PARTS THAT HAVE BEEN NEGLECTED.  IF YOU SEND IT IN WE CAN SEE WHAT WE CAN DO BUT I DON’T WANT TO MAKE ANY PROMISES WITHOUT SEEING THE PRODUCT.

 

Marc Caravaggio
Parts Manager
Alba Action Sports
(858)486-4380 X.204
(858)679-7947 fax

My last email
Well if it's only a 6 month warranty then it's definitely not covered. WOW! So there's really no need to send the pipe out is there? That's time and money wasted. Since the pipe only comes with a six month manufactures warranty (which is awfully a short warranty) there's not much I can do except look into getting a pipe that's more durable. The Alba performed well for me but if I would have known then what I know now I WOULD HAVE NEVER PURCHASED AN ALBA. Sparks is offering a 2 year warranty on his pipes so that's probably the direction I'll be looking. I know you have to do what's best for your company but I wish I would have gotten the invoice from the dealer. I also wish I would have been advised of this short warranty as well. At least I would have saved myself the aggravation of trying to have something warrantied that's not even under warranty. Well, on to something more durable...

Whatta you guys think?

[Bigscrb15]

Sounds like they have a crappy product and know they do. However, the way you are responding to them almost sounds like you are trying to hide abuse to the pipe(although we all know you don't abuse your stuff, they don't.) I think you should just wipe your hands clean of this pipe and go with a different company.I can't believe that all that is happening to that pipe.

[Ride1Rob]

However, the way you are responding to them almost sounds like you are trying to hide abuse to the pipe(although we all know you don't abuse your stuff, they don't.)

What did I say? The reason I'm saying that I don't really want to send it to them is because I feel it will be a waste of my time and money. On one hand he's saying it's not under warranty, on the other hand he's saying send it to them to inspect it. I sent them pics of the pieces that are coming apart and you can see from the pics that the pipe is not abused. I'm upset b/c I haven't ridden in over 2 weeks and this is going to drag out even further another 2-3 weeks waiting on them to send me something back. Honestly, I wouldn't purchase another one if they gave me half price off. I'd probably be in the same situation in a year or so. Here's a post from someone on another site that had the same problem....


Wow Man! That does suck. I use alot of Alba products on my YFZ including their Pipe and I usually have good things to say but this sounds whack. Your topic caught my attention because I had the exact same thing happen to my header that your buddies did. It developed a hair line crack at the collar at the front of the pipe where it mounts to the head, so there was an exhaust leak. I discovered it after I noticed a drop in power, back fire popping on decel, and no high revs. It did not break completly like yours did. I have the older 2 piece design. I called the parts dept. and told them about my situation and at first they said the same "we'll send you a new header pipe for X amount of dollars". This was some time last year, about the same time they were coming out with the new three piece. I asked to make sure they were going to send the two piece and replied that they no longer have them in stock. Then they put me on hold as he went to check the stock room. He said he found a used one with one ride on it for dirt cheap (sorry can't remember the exact price but I wanna say around $20?) So I thought, okay-cheap fix. No problems since. I bought the Original pipe almost 3 years ago now and gotta agree, it performs and sounds good. Ask them if they can do something similar. I'd stay on the phone with them too, Hope that helps.

[Bigscrb15]

Its not what you said, its just how I am thinking they will take it. They are gonna be thinking "He doesn't want to send it back because he abused it." They won't look at the inconvenience factor to you. It's good you arent going to waste your money and time to send it to them just so they can say, "I am sorry but we will have to enforce our 6month warrant" and now you are out a pipe and money and maybe a couple races. Hey, I have an idea, drope the bike off at Sky, they can fix it;) Just need to leave it for 3months.

[MOTOCROSS MAVERICK]

what an over $300 piece of junk! that is terrible Rob! i would go with the sparks you cant go wrong. in the past i have had no problems with the warrentee department at sparks. they are good! too bad this didnt happen a couple of week ago i just sold my ceramic coated & powdercoated full sparks for $200, new packing and everything! 

[Ride1Rob]

Its not what you said, its just how I am thinking they will take it. They are gonna be thinking "He doesn't want to send it back because he abused it." They won't look at the inconvenience factor to you. It's good you arent going to waste your money and time to send it to them just so they can say, "I am sorry but we will have to enforce our 6month warrant" and now you are out a pipe and money and maybe a couple races. Hey, I have an idea, drope the bike off at Sky, they can fix it;) Just need to leave it for 3months.

Yeah, after reading through it I can see where they might think that. But then they should take into consideration the pics I sent. My thinking was that I'd be sending it in for nothing if it fell out of the warranty. And as far Sky (lol). You hit the nail right on the head. Took them over a month to change my swinger when it cracked. All they had to do was give me the part and I could have done it myself in a couple of hours. Since my bike now is out of the warranty, they won't see for ANYTHING! As far as pipes, my next one will be either a Sparks (because of new 3 year warranty) or a Yoshi (have never heard anything bad about those coming apart).

what an over $300 piece of junk! that is terrible Rob! i would go with the sparks you cant go wrong. in the past i have had no problems with the warrentee department at sparks. they are good! too bad this didnt happen a couple of week ago i just sold my ceramic coated & powdercoated full sparks for $200, new packing and everything! 

 

[Ride1Rob]

This is an Email that I just got from Marc...
SCOTT, THE REASON I WANT TO SEE THE PIPE IS TO SEE IF WE CAN WORK SOMETHING OUT OR DO A PARTIAL WARRANTY DEPENDING ON ITS CONDITION.  I NEVER SAID THAT I WOULDN’T DO ANYTHING OR THAT I’M NOT WILLING TO WORK WITH YOU, I JUST NEED TO SEE THE PIPE BEFORE I MAKE ANY RASH DECISIONS.  IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEND IT IN, I’M MORE THAN WILLING TO WORK WITH YOU AND GET THIS ISSUE RESOLVED INSTEAD OF YOU PURCHASING ANOTHER FULL SYSTEM ELSEWHERE.

 

Marc Caravaggio
Parts Manager
Alba Action Sports
(858)486-4380 X.204
(858)679-7947 fax

My reply...
I gotcha Marc! I'm just alil upset that's all. I'll see if I can box it up and send it out today. I just don't want to have to spend alot of money on something that should have lasted longer than alil over a year. But I do want to at least make some type of effort to get this resolved. Where do I send it and to whom do I send it to?

[1FasterBlaster]

  They'll probably get back to you after their inspection and tell you you'll have to purchase a new one. I would then tell them your posting this on the biggest ATV forum in Florida and see how it affects their market.
   

[Inyourdraft2000]

Well it sounds like Alba wants to stick to there sorry warranty and not take care of the customer......their loss I guess even though you are out a 300$ exhaust set up....
I am in the customer service buisness and we would ask as they did to see the pipe but we d require an invoice (bunch of red tape put on us by corporate)...BUt to see the pipe to study what went wrong as to make the proper fix so it does not hapen again. And they could have sent you another and wrote off the damaged one....It is not that hard to take care of the customer and fudge the paperwork later if you know what I mean.... Tough break kid.......

[Chuck_Norris]

I just sent them an E-mail to the Complaint Dept listed on their webiste  marc@albaaction.com
 Here is what I wrote hope it helps. 

Marc

My name is Bill Norris. A fellow rider has posted a situation involving you folks regarding a defective pipe for his YFZ450. Here is the link to referenced topic.   

http://www.atvflorida.com/forum/index.php/topic,25927.0.html

 

Here is my concern, we have 5000 members on our website where the concern is posted and more than 5000 on another local Florida based website that this post has also been submitted to. There is more than a likely chance that someone considering the purchase of your product will be reconsidering their purchase options after reading this. Your current decision just doesn’t make good business sense for customer retention.

 I am currently running a White Brothers "E" series 2.  Similar to the concern that was posted on the Website; I experienced a failure of the pipes mounting bracket. The pictures were sent and reviewed by the staff at White Brothers. I received a new updated version of the exhaust system within days of sending the old version back to White Brothers. The Pipe was nearly 2 years old. This is a clear great customer service & satisfaction; further more a company that stands by their products 

I am not expecting you to change your decision based on this letter but only to consider the repercussions of poor customer service

Thanks for considering my letter

Bill Norris

Florida ATV Association

[Ride1Rob]

Hey, thanks Chuck! It's great to have brotherly support  . That's nice how White Brothers took care of you and I would have thought that they would have done the same thing for me. Well, I have the pipe boxed up but I'm not expecting much. I've already set myself on telling them to keep the pipe if their not talking right.

  They'll probably get back to you after their inspection and tell you you'll have to purchase a new one. I would then tell them your posting this on the biggest ATV forum in Florida and see how it affects their market.
   

Yeah, that's what I was thinkin also and kinda why I felt like it was a waste of time to send it out to them. But if I don't put a foot forward to resolve it then I can't complain much can I?

[MPTonyT]

i would wipe my hands and go with another company. i delt with a similar issue with Yoshimura and they had me mail the pipe to them and they shipped me a new one with no questions asked. they didnt even care when it was purchased. for your bike i would go with CSR due to the good luck and performance gains that "THE MOTOCROSS MAVERICK" has had. as he said i just sold his exhaust for him  (pretty much barnd new) for 219 shipped. sorry for your inconvenience but things happen for a reason.... I'm a firm believer of that...

[KB]

Ride1Rob, I'd be upset too. Maybe try to get a hold of ATP Racing & see if they can give you any advice on how to handle your situation.
I bought her '05 YFZ (black & green) & it has an Alba Pipe on it, just a thought.

[eldiablo64]

glad i went with HMF

[53yfz450]

Most of the problems that have happened to you are due to bolts vibrating loose. i have been running there exhausts for 2 years now and have not had any problems because i check all the bolts after everyride. The one time my header broke is when my header bolts were loose and it broke due to vibration. All exhausts and i mean all will crack and break because i have had a sparks an HMF and a duncan and i cracked all three i think it leads down to maintance to keep them together. Rob if you would like 2 talk to my dad he can talk to them for you beeing as i am sponsored by them and know the right people to talk to maybe my dad can try and talk to them

[53yfz450]

glad i went with HMF

you would be amazed how many exhaust companies out there are made bye the same person. alba balwin hmf all identical exhausts

[FoxHondaRider]

Thats what i'm looking at is an HMF slip on for my 400ex. 

[Ida_Mann]

just use what I do in this situation,,,,,,

customer service "I'm sorry sir, we cannot warranty your part because it is clearly out of warranty by now."

me "you do realize I am posting my entire experience on the largest ATV website in Florida with over 6000 members reading it right?"

customer service "I do realize that, but if we make an exception in your case then we would lose our shirts making exceptions everywhere to everyone and we cannot do that, I'm sorry for your inconvenience"

me "is it because I'm black?"

customer service 'click'

;-)

Id@

[Chuck_Norris]

 

[MOTOCROSS MAVERICK]

just use what I do in this situation,,,,,,

customer service "I'm sorry sir, we cannot warranty your part because it is clearly out of warranty by now."

me "you do realize I am posting my entire experience on the largest ATV website in Florida with over 6000 members reading it right?"

customer service "I do realize that, but if we make an exception in your case then we would lose our shirts making exceptions everywhere to everyone and we cannot do that, I'm sorry for your inconvenience"

me "is it because I'm black?"

customer service 'click'

;-)

Id@

lol that is so funny!!!!!!!!! 

[Ride1Rob]

Most of the problems that have happened to you are due to bolts vibrating loose. i have been running there exhausts for 2 years now and have not had any problems because i check all the bolts after everyride. The one time my header broke is when my header bolts were loose and it broke due to vibration. All exhausts and i mean all will crack and break because i have had a sparks an HMF and a duncan and i cracked all three i think it leads down to maintance to keep them together. Rob if you would like 2 talk to my dad he can talk to them for you beeing as i am sponsored by them and know the right people to talk to maybe my dad can try and talk to them

You're right in certain situations, but in mine... You're wrong. My header bolts have never been loose as I always loctite them to keep such from happening. When I removed the cracked header... bolts still tight! Also, explain why the rivets in the front of the canister rattled loose? I had to rivet extra rivets for security. In the front of the canister where it's welded to the rear of the back part of the pipe... Weld is cracked all around and moves a tad bit. From what I'm told from the dealer that I got it from, they've changed the pipe again from the one I have. I wonder why . And you state that you've been running their "Exhausts" for 2 years. How many have you had to put on that bike? Maybe it wasn't an issue for you because you purchased a new one every few months or so.

[MOTOCROSS MAVERICK]

You're right in certain situations, but in mine... You're wrong. My header bolts have never been loose as I always loctite them to keep such from happening. When I removed the cracked header... bolts still tight! Also, explain why the rivets in the front of the canister rattled loose? I had to rivet extra rivets for security. In the front of the canister where it's welded to the rear of the back part of the pipe... Weld is cracked all around and moves a tad bit. From what I'm told from the dealer that I got it from, they've changed the pipe again from the one I have. I wonder why

you are right! that pipe was a piece! and there customer service? garbage! i had one little crack in the aluminum can where the head went in on my sparks. called them up no questions we will send you a new one once they get the old one. 6 month warrentee with that kind of product they shouldn't even have a warrentee on it!

[Ride1Rob]

Ride1Rob, I'd be upset too. Maybe try to get a hold of ATP Racing & see if they can give you any advice on how to handle your situation.
I bought her '05 YFZ (black & green) & it has an Alba Pipe on it, just a thought.

Thanx KB but no thanks on your offer. It may decide to come apart on me. And since you have the bike now, that pipe was ordered from where mine was but a bit after mine. The bike you have was not ridden for months so yours doesn't have the time on it.

[LostCause]

I would go with another system, send them your system, when and if they send you a new one turn around and sell it.  That way you are not out anything.

[greenmachine]

For what its worth...I bought my son a brand new DRX90 mini quad. It comes stock with an aftermarket style race pipe. I have had the exhaust bolts fall out 3 times in 6 months. I have called the dealer & he sent me 2 new sets of bolts(free). I used loctite on the first 2 sets & they still vibrated out.

The silencer rivets...3 out of 4 vibrated loose & 1 fell out. I replaced the bolts & the rivets with a total cost of about $3.00 including the loctite.
Now I check the whole quad for loose fasteners after every couple rides. So far so good. The rivets I put in there are better than the stock ones anyways.

My question to you is what color loctite did you use? red, blue or green?

When using loctite for high temps, you MUST use the green. Red or blue wont hold long.