I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE

[Chuck_Norris]

So what are you saying?  I should be thrown out of public school because my beliefs(at that time) required me to not participate in the Pledge?  Doesn't sound like freedom of religion to me.  And who's to say what's right in that aspect?  Who is, and what action is someone being yellow and spineless about?

I dont  know you on a personal level and mean you no disrepect but you last comment  sounds like absolute and utter disrespect for what has been done on your behalf

[WPBSMOKA]

In response to the modification......
This war for example.  I would serve my jail time before putting a bullet in someones head.  And every American is entitled to this option.  I could not take someones life for any reason.  Even if it came down to me or him.

[WPBSMOKA]

How is following guidelines for a religion disrespectful.  Would it not be the person trying to make me doing something against my religion the disrespectful one? 

[Chuck_Norris]

How is following guidelines for a religion disrespectful.  Would it not be the person trying to make me doing something against my religion the disrespectful one? 

guide lines for religion is something that is followed with the respect of the gift given by Jesus Christ,( my belief) The gift of salvation was given unto me therefore I respect the guide lines within.  you can believe that  your religous freedom comes from somewhere else, but somewhere someone had to fight for the freedom you are enjoying..Freedom is given unto me via my Military brothers and sisters, therefore I return the safety and securty they have provide with simple repect for what they have done for me.

[wilburz]

In response to the modification......
This war for example.  I would serve my jail time before putting a bullet in someones head.  And every American is entitled to this option.  I could not take someones life for any reason.  Even if it came down to me or him.

One of the few things our government makes its people do is sign up for the Selective Service. I would assume you have registered right?  If there was a draft then I guess you would be one of those so called "draft dodgers" right?

[bluesman]

In response to the modification......
This war for example.  I would serve my jail time before putting a bullet in someones head.  And every American is entitled to this option.  I could not take someones life for any reason.  Even if it came down to me or him.

    thank GOD for people like me and our military so you dont have to!!

[yunt2ride]

In response to the modification......
This war for example.  I would serve my jail time before putting a bullet in someones head.  And every American is entitled to this option.  I could not take someones life for any reason.  Even if it came down to me or him.

So I take it if someone comes in your house and tries to murder you or your family, you would not try to kill them first. These  people come to our country and fly planes in our buildings and they should not be punished. If it wasn't for this war they would have already bombed us again.

[Moose]

People    People   People


Debate is good.       Personal attacks of ANY kind is NOT.


Understand

[WPBSMOKA]

**Keep in mind I am Agnostic, arguing from a religious point of view that requires this of their followers.  **
Listen, I am not worried about what you or the next guy thinks is disrespectful. When it comes to answering to God, you could call me everyname in the book including spineless and yellow.  But if my beliefs say to do or not do something, then that's what I will do!  Why would I throw away what I believe to be a chance for a perfect life just because I am worried about offending some worldly people?!?!  I just don't understand.  Why is it disrespect for believing in something. Because it doesn't coincide with your beliefs? 

[WPBSMOKA]

No, you are  probably right Yunt.  :(I most likely would make an attempt to restrain them in some form.  I really couldn't give an honest answer on how I would respond to a situation like that, but I would assume I would make an attempt to survive. 
Yes I would be a draft dodger.  Try and start something over that, see if I care.  I'm not about to put my life on the line for anyone, unless there was no way around it. 
Bluesman-respect

[AlterEgo]

No, you are  probably right Yunt.  :(I most likely would make an attempt to restrain them in some form.  I really couldn't give an honest answer on how I would respond to a situation like that, but I would assume I would make an attempt to survive. 
Yes I would be a draft dodger.  Try and start something over that, see if I care.  I'm not about to put my life on the line for anyone, unless there was no way around it. 
Bluesman-respect

You should probably stop riding, you might run over a bug and kill it. 

Lighten up, nobody is forcing you to do anything. Worship a god, kill someone, or even say a pledge. These are all just opinions here, and like something else, everyone's got one. Check on over at www.iwon'trecitethepledgebecausei'magnostic.com I think they've got a few good forums for you.

[WPBSMOKA]

Lighten up. LOL.  I am not even fired up.  I am not worried about killing bugs either. And these people ARE being forced to say that they acknowledge GOD!  Everyone keeps saying that noone is making them do anything.  This is a false statement.  Taking the word God off of our money is not forcing you to do anything.  Leaving it on is forcing everyone in the nation to be titled as a believer in GOD!  I can't even see why this is a debate.  I would not be offended in any way if it was taken off and I believe in God.  But I would be offended if I did not believe in God, and this country(that is supposed to have freedom of religion, including not particiating in any) made me have on display that I did!  I am just a very open minded individual, who tends to take the side of the minority in debates.

[Chuck_Norris]

**Keep in mind I am Agnostic, arguing from a religious point of view that requires this of their followers.  **
Listen, I am not worried about what you or the next guy thinks is disrespectful. When it comes to answering to God, you could call me everyname in the book including spineless and yellow.  But if my beliefs say to do or not do something, then that's what I will do!  Why would I throw away what I believe to be a chance for a perfect life just because I am worried about offending some worldly people?!?!  I just don't understand.  Why is it disrespect for believing in something. Because it doesn't coincide with your beliefs? 

lets be clear... the comment about being spineless and yellow was refferring to the public school system not a personal attack, non of the comments I have made were personal attacks, just so that we have an understanding

[WPBSMOKA]

Ok, that was a misunderstanding then. Thaks for clearing it up!  As far as I know, I haven't made any comments that I should worry about offending someone. Well my views on this subject may offend some people, but I mean no name calling or anything like that.  If you feel I have made an offensive statement directed towards you(anyone), please let me know.   

[AlterEgo]

Lighten up. LOL.  I am not even fired up.  I am not worried about killing bugs either. And these people ARE being forced to say that they acknowledge GOD!  Everyone keeps saying that noone is making them do anything.  This is a false statement.  Taking the word God off of our money is not forcing you to do anything.  Leaving it on is forcing everyone in the nation to be titled as a believer in GOD!  I can't even see why this is a debate.  I would not be offended in any way if it was taken off and I believe in God.  But I would be offended if I did not believe in God, and this country(that is supposed to have freedom of religion, including not particiating in any) made me have on display that I did!  I am just a very open minded individual, who tends to take the side of the minority in debates.

Nothing wrong with having your opinion. Isn't freedom great. I happen to disagree with you, but that's my opinion and I'm not going to sit here and argue all day about it.

The other great thing about this country is that things can be changed if you have a majority that agrees with you. But, if this thread is any indication, it looks like God will probably remain in the pledge and on our money.

[WPBSMOKA]

I can agree with every bit of that.

[bluesman]

OK GOT QUESTION, IF <YOU> DONT BELIEVE IN GOD..
WHY DO YOU CARE WHAT YOU PLEDGE?



 
      I DONT BELEIVE IN THE TOOTH FAIRY  ,BUT I ALLWAYS GOT MONEY UNDER MY PILLOW!!
 
   AND IF ITS BEEN THIS WAY FOR 50,70 OR A HUNDRED YEARS AND ALL THESE NEW PEOPLE COME HERE WHY DO THE WANT TO CHANGE US???
THEY SHOULD BE MORE LIKE US!!!!   COMFORN TO US NOT US TO THEM



   IF ITS NOT BROKE DONT MESS WITH IT

[Loven It]

**Keep in mind I am Agnostic, arguing from a religious point of view that requires this of their followers.  **

Can explain your defination of Agnostic please?

[WPBSMOKA]

OK GOT QUESTION, IF <YOU> DONT BELIEVE IN GOD..
WHY DO YOU CARE WHAT YOU PLEDGE?
I DONT BELEIVE IN THE TOOTH FAIRY  ,BUT I ALLWAYS GOT MONEY UNDER MY PILLOW!!
  AND IF ITS BEEN THIS WAY FOR 50,70 OR A HUNDRED YEARS AND ALL THESE NEW PEOPLE COME HERE WHY DO THE WANT TO CHANGE US???
THEY SHOULD BE MORE LIKE US!!!!   COMFORN TO US NOT US TO THEM
IF ITS NOT BROKE DONT MESS WITH IT

Go back to when the pledge was originally written.  Under God wasn't written in then. This isn't people coming over on boats, these are people like you and me.  And like the post a little bit ago said, majority rules! So there might be a change soon, whether it's broken or not. I am not saying I do or don't believe in God!  So don't put those words in my mouth!!!! And noone is trying to conform anyone.  By having that removed, does it affect your beliefs?  Does it change in any way your relationship with who you choose to serve as your higher?

[WPBSMOKA]

**Keep in mind I am Agnostic, arguing from a religious point of view that requires this of their followers.  **

Can explain your defination of Agnostic please?

Agnostic-Not saying there is, not saying there isn't.
My reason is I really am not concerned whether there is or not.  I am more into immediate pleasures as opposed to long term.
Athiest does not believe in God.

[bluesman]

YOU STILL DIDNT ANSWER THE QUESTION YOU JUST STATED HOW YOU SEE IT
 
 
 
 
 
   

[WPBSMOKA]

So what's the question, why do I care what I pledge. Or why do people that are arguing with God being in the pledge care what they pledge?
I want to point out to you again that I never said I do not believe in God!!!   It would have been nice for you to show some respect after that and change your question around rather than ask me the same question I just told you does not apply to me!!!!!!!!!
Myself, I don't pledge, therefore I don't care if it says "one nation under the anti-christ"!!!
Other people, they have their own beliefs that God may not be a part of.
"If you don't believe in God, why do you care what you pledge" What the heck does that mean anyway?  Doesn't the pledge have to do with the country?  Why is God involved with it?  Not everyone in the country is involved with God.

[bluesman]

DUDE VERY NICE DEBATE. IAM NOT MAD HOPE YOUR NOT.
    LETS GO BACK TO THE START   JULY 2 1776
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.—That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,—That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security

[bluesman]

I SEE THE WORD   CREATOR!!!!!  1776 HMMMMMMM

[WPBSMOKA]

I don't see the words Pledge of Allegiance. Hmm.....
I don't know about you, but my creator was my mother and my father. How we're you created?