rotten riders wrecking it for everyone

[shackles]

I was riding at Big Scrub today and went past some folks that were just ripping through a big marsh- tearing it up.  We all know that that's what will get any new trails they're making out there shut down but still there are those jerks that won't play by the rules.  What's up with that???  We all need to help turn those people in to the rangers or they are going to wreck it for everyone.  Comments???

[stacktester]

You're right about a few wrecking it for us. I love Scrub and I'm gonna hate it when it's gone. I ride the trails and powerline only. I come across the wetlands too and see where it's been torn up. Good job guy's who do that. Bravo!!!!!

This is the problem. When we don't have anyplace to ride because of these peckerheads they will be somewhere else tearing something else up and we will be looking at 4 wheelers with nowhere to ride. I swear if I ride up on some people doing this $h!t I'm calling the forestry right then and giving a description. I've said all along the forestry needs to give zero tolerance to wetland areas of all the forests. Go in your back yards and let the hose run for a few hours then tear the living hell out of it dip$hit. Bet you won't because you have to clean it up. Get my point. I might just volunteer out at scrub once a month just to turn in these idiot's. Enough said.

[AlterEgo]

Well said. I'm with you.

We've got a thread with emergency nextel numbers. How about a thread with Ranger numbers for various areas to report these idiot that are essentially stealing what few riding areas we have left.

[stacktester]

I agree alter. In order to keep what we have we have to put back in. I think if we work with the forest folks and help out there we can come up with a plan to have a riding place. I'm telling you now we have got to have organization in conjunction with the rangers. I think in order to ride in any forest you have to take a quick test to educate people on how NOT to tear the forest up. We have ranger stations all over that can provide a test area. The test needs to be like an atv permit. In other words like reading the rules of riding in Nat'l and State Forests. If you get caught doing something wrong then u pay a fine. Get too many points and your A$$ is gone. ZERO TOLERANCE on tearing up wetlands and virgin land. Ride on the powerline and logging roads. I'm telling you it's coming to an end if we don't get together and go talk to the forestry and put together a plan that works for all of us. On another note, I think if you charged 50 bucks a year to ride in ONF it would weed out a lot of rift raft. Nobody wants to pay to tear something up when you can do it for free. Man I swear I'm on fire and wanting to whip A$$ on dumb riders who are doing this. I'm coming to scrub in the next couple weeks and I plan on talking to some people. Anybody who wants to get together for a beer and discuss a real beginning of an organization I'm ready. I'm not shy to go up and talk to a ranger and ask them what we need to do.

[1FasterBlaster]

I'm not condoning people tearing up woods to ride, but that's how trails are made. Through dry land or mud.That's not the reason their shutting down forest on riders.Hell, forestry tears down miles and miles of land for production. I know, I've worked for them.
  It's a political venue with upperclass people who think anyone who likes to play in the dirt is worthless.Land for more condo's and retirement communites makes more money , than a bunch of riders on A.T.V.'s.
  There outnumbering us because we don't have a large community organization to fight for our riding rights. There's noone right now voicing our side of the story.We need to organize with some kind of group to show how large of a community of people there really is in the ATV world!!

[ATVXtreme]

I am reading your replys your all right.. To call a law enforcement officer in there is useless, be time he gets there, that person is gone. What you need to do is go to the campground, and ask the host if you can talk to a Forest Ranger, or a Forest Protection Officer, she should be able to reach someone on the 2 way radio, or one might be there. Make sure they are an offical ranger, not a volunteer. Explain the situation and ask the ranger if I see this happening how can I get intouch with you to stop him. If whom you are talking to is an Forest Protection Officer, if they catch him he will get a ticket. Or Call the Ranger District when you get home tonight I think they close at 5:00 pm, ask to speak with the Ranger who is in charge of the Big Scrub area. Make a suggestion about the nextell number. Let me know what happens.

As far as paying a price to get in, my thoughts are he is probably someone who is local, and doesn't care about rules and regulations, so paying a fee to get in, won't stop him. Think about it, think about how big the forest is, a whole lot of ways to get in to avoid a fee.

Stacktester - your quick test may come to reality. But again will that stop the person that wants to break the rules.. I don't think so... The only person you are hurting is you because now you have to pay to get in.

This website participants need to think about organizing it as a club, to be an entity of one, to be a powerful voice, and I know someone that is working on that aspect of it, but it will take time.

[ATVXtreme]

I'm coming to scrub in the next couple weeks and I plan on talking to some people. Anybody who wants to get together for a beer and discuss a real beginning of an organization I'm ready. I'm not shy to go up and talk to a ranger and ask them what we need to do.

Talk to one of the rangers on the phone, but don't be pissed off, make it positive. Let me know when you are going to be at big scrub...

Regarding my previous comments, a Ranger is a Ranger in the offical green Uniform. Also get the name with whom you are speaking with.

[americanhighlander]

Take a video camera next time.They might
know who person is and the next time they catch person.
Get his permit sticker number on atv when talk to rider..

I agree with you on here about
those jerks and those kind people that get
our riding areas shutting down becuase that kind of stuff.
Look what happen all other riding areas throught florida.

I know people need repect the trails out there...

But I do understand about that....

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

Take a video camera next time.They might
know who person is and the next time they catch person.
Get his permit sticker number on atv when talk to rider..

Great Idea... Keep your friends close and your enemy closer...make small talk get thier reg # and report them, We have to be proactive about this and make a difference.

[1FasterBlaster]

 You people sound as if you've never gone through a part of the forest that didn't have trails. Your doing exactly what the other class wants you to do- to think we are destroying the forest and report that someone has disrupted the delicate balance of the eco system. And after your riding area's are Condo's or retirement communities...you'll regret what you did.
 Trails didn't grow in the forest, we made them.If you turn people in for saying their doing something wrong, then you might as well park your quads or dirtbikes also.     We aren't damaging riding area's, because that's exactly what they are...riding area's.Instead of focusing in on what they say we are doing, we need to focus on what they are trying to do and stop them.

[ATVXtreme]

You have two ways to stop them, the legal way which is the law, or the other is just stop them and talk to them. If you stop them and talk to them, they may leave, and respect your opinion, the flip side is... who is that person, maybe he has a gun, or maybe a fight will breakout, because tempers flare. Now who is at fault, when one is dead or one goes to jail, or you both go to jail, and now you have lost your riding area.

Think about it, I was in that situation at big scrub.

[AlterEgo]

You people sound as if you've never gone through a part of the forest that didn't have trails. Your doing exactly what the other class wants you to do- to think we are destroying the forest and report that someone has disrupted the delicate balance of the eco system. And after your riding area's are Condo's or retirement communities...you'll regret what you did.
 Trails didn't grow in the forest, we made them.If you turn people in for saying their doing something wrong, then you might as well park your quads or dirtbikes also.     We aren't damaging riding area's, because that's exactly what they are...riding area's.Instead of focusing in on what they say we are doing, we need to focus on what they are trying to do and stop them.

Riding areas aren't just "riding areas". They are hunting areas, hiking areas, camping areas, eco sensitive areas, etc . . . Taking the attitude that the forest is ours (atvers) to do with what we like without concern for the other uses is exactly the attitude that will get all riding banned.

The powers that be are not limiting riding with the intention of creating condos or retirement communities. They are limiting it because of the growing number of trails and damage to areas that can't sustain the impacts of riding. As you say "trails didn't grow in the forest, we made them". And we continue to make them, and make them. They are also limiting it because of complaints of irresponsible riding and trashing the forest.

I'm as pissed off as the next rider at the continued restrictions and loss of riding area. But fighting an "all or nothing battle" will get you the "nothing" part real fast. It is going to take compromise and responsible use to save what we have - and gain riding areas.

I can't count the number of times I've seen in posts that it's "all the fault of a few bad apples". Well hey, if that's the case then weeding out the few bad apples will go a long way to solving the problem, right? And if you ain't a bad apple, you got nuthin' to worry 'bout.

[americanhighlander]

I guess we need owned our nat forest if
they close down onf. 

But i guess alot people might do  that soon
if this keeps up wrecking trail forest system.
It sounds like too many riders in one place part of nat forest.
I know how that is,always bad rider loves to spoil for
us ruining our sport and taking peoples blame for it.

[POLARIS 330]

I BELIVE THAT YES THERE ARE CURTIAN AREAS THAT THIS SHOULD NOT BE GOING ON BUT COME ON WE ALL LIKE TO GET MUDDY AT TIMES, BUT I BELIVE THERE ARE WAYS TO GO ABOUT THIS WITH OUT DESTROYING EVERY THING IN YOUR PATH.

[ATVXtreme]

Watch out for the rangers, there tree huggers..

[yamaha350r]

yea they have places that have mud pits and stuff just go to them...its made for gettin muddy

[1FasterBlaster]

The problem isn't destruction of forest, it's not giving more land for riding. There are more golf courses in the world than riding area's. Just like any growing recreation, when it grows, you have to expand. If there are more people riding, then of course they'll be wanting to make more trails and mudd pits. Who wants to ride the same trails and bog the same mudd pit...I don't.
  You can't tell me you've never ridden off the trails before.Stop trying to sound like your a ranger. Even Yogi bear saw the big picture...get the picnic basket while you can BooBoo!!

[GSPKurt]

Just FYI- There are several members here who are volunteer rangers. I was one, as well, but time and job constraints forced me to resign. They're definitely NOT tree huggers. Also, there are areas which are sensitive for different reasons, like species habitat, wetlands, etc. When logging roads are cut in and timber is harvested, it is NOT in an ecologically sensitive area. There IS a difference. I am so tired of hearing this "I'll ride where I want" crap. The forest is MULTI-USE. It is managed for timber production, recreation, habitat preservation... It is not so we as ATVers can tear it up as we see fit. Yes, others do it, and that does not make it OK for us to do it. If it persists, I can guaran-darn-tee it, we won't be able to ride there at all.

[ATVXtreme]

Just FYI- There are several members here who are volunteer rangers. I was one, as well, but time and job constraints forced me to resign. They're definitely NOT tree huggers.

I detect a little sensativity. I feel the need to clarify my statement - I said Rangers not Volunteer Rangers, there is a differance.

Now that that point has been cleared up - you are right about the forest, everyone pays taxes...

[stacktester]

Just because you pay taxes doesn't give a right to trash public land. Go throw a piece of trash out a window and tell the cop who pulls you over you pay taxes so u got the right to throw trash. Picture this. Go $hit in your toilet for say 1 day and don't flush it. Get the pic. That's what's going on in our forest now and it's only a few dipshit's doing it. If somebody wants to mud it up go to one of the ATV parks who promote this. Like Kurt said, the forest is multi-use and we all have to do our part so we can share the land. I've said for months if the forest makes riders pay a fee and get a permit for their bike it will eliminate a lot of yahoo's real quick.

[1FasterBlaster]

Well how do you trash a forest by riding through it. I can see if someone is dumping garbage, but riding through woods is what everyone is out there doing. As far as rangers go, some of you think your an authority and talk to everyone like their kids,trying to write tickets all the time for everything...even when we aren't doing anything wrong, you try to find something wrong.
 I had a ranger tell me not to do donuts on a trail...what the hell is that.Everyone does donuts. I think you take your jobs too seriously sometimes. I know having riding area's are important...I love to ride. But if You keep binding down on something that people have been doing for years- and it doesn't matter if it's for preservation- you take away peoples recreation, and their eventually gonna be like,"The hell with preservation!"