ATV Florida Forum

with Christmas comin, i am asking for a hunting rifle. i need some opinions.

first, the rifle. what do you think about, Sako, Remington, Winchester, Ruger, Mossberg, Savage, and any other you can think of? also what caliber, anything important when choosing one. i was leaning toward a Tikka (by Sako, imported by Beretta) T3 Lite rifle in .308.

as for the scope, the rifle i want comes with scope rings and mounts. so i was lookin at a burris fulfield 2 scope in 3-9x40. is that good?

Before anyone can give you a good opinion you really should tell us how much money you are willing to spend.  That has a lot to do with it.  And also where and what you will be hunting.  In florida you can get away with a smaller calliber.  But anywhere else you need something with plenty of power for the bigger animals.

it will be in florida and maybe tennessee and some southern states too. if i move out of florida i want a good enough gun there too. i want to spend between 600-1000. most of those guns are in the 500 to 600 dollar range (msrp). the scope i want is 200. so that is round 800 unless i find one on sale or somethin. would a .308 take down a elk or moose? and how far is their range?

I like my 270, has served me well. I wouldn't go smaller than a 270 here in fla with the hogs if you hunt them. Any size gun will take down an elk or moose if it is a well placed shot. I like the 30-06,270,7mm mag and 300mags. I have a savage and it has done great with no problems at all. I love rugers and that would be my next rifle, but my next gun will be the 500 S&W revolver most likely ;D(<that can do it all also)

well i guess my question bout caliber is, will a .308 take down any game in the U.S. that i want to hunt? i wont hunt bear just deer and hogs with it. or deer like animals.

I like to drop hogs where they are at and not have to trail them. For pretty much anything in the North america the 30-06 270 7mm mag and 300mag will get the job done. 308s im not to filmilar with so im not for sure, but if i remember right is sorta like a 243 which is more for long distance more than knock down power.

(http://www.ballade.no/nmi.nsf/pic/dirtyharrystor/$file/dirtyharrystor.jpg)

44 mag, almost as long as a rifle. then you can ask the hog if he feels lucky

.270 is a nice caliber; not too much recoil but definitely lacking in power.  It's a great round for women and children or those who are a tad gun shy.  30-06 or 7mm Rem Mag are probably the two best calibers for overall general purpose hunting.  I chose the 7mm Rem Mag because the recoil is handled a little easier and there is a wide range of bullet weights to choose from.  The higher velocity makes long shots a lot easier to make (less drop to compensate for).  This comment will probably irritate some others because there are quite a few different calibers to choose from but the two I mention are generally regarded as the best for all around hunting.

well the .308 is a short action bullet, and it will shoot like 300yds with little drop. my friend killed a deer from a lil over 200 yards with one the other day.

xr100racer, i carry the 44 on my side for protection from bears and such. need somethin a lil more accurate.

digginfool, does a 7mm rem mag kick less than a 30-06?

IMO, yes.  I have a Remington Model 700 in 7mm Rem Mag and it is a fine shooting rifle.  I have also hunted with the Model 700 in 30-06 and I definitely prefer the 7mm.

will they shoot as far as 300 yards?

270s don't really lack in power and the recoil is about the same as a 30-06, might have got it mixed with 243? but mine has dropped everything i have shot with it(3pigs one that was almost 400lbs)

i have really almost decided what rifle to get but not a scope. anyone have or had a burris fulfield 2?

I highly recommend the Burris Fullfield 2 in 3.5x10-50mm.  It is what I use on my Model 700.  It's light gathering capability and crystal clear optics makes this a fine scope, particularly when you consider the price point.  One thing to consider, the .30-06 has been around forever and you will find that ammo at almost any store that sells any kind of ammo.  That may not be true for some of the more exotic calibers.  Even as popular as the 7mm Rem Mag is, I have been in stores that did not carry bullets in that caliber.  Granted, we're not talking major sporting goods or hunting shops, but sometimes you have to take what you can get.  If you do go with .308, .300 or 7mm, just be sure to buy your ammo before you get too far from civilization.  BTW, .270 is nearly the decimal equivalent of 7mm.  Stand the two shells next to each other and you will see why the 7mm Rem Mag has so much more power than a .270.  One thing to be aware of, a .270 will chamber into a 7mm Rem Mag rifle but will explode in your face if you fire it.  The 7mm Rem Mag will not chamber into a .270 rifle.

Burris makes good quality scopes.   The .308 is a fine caliber choice for a rifle and its ballistics are close to a 30-06 due to a more efficient cartridge design.  It will work on any game in North America, but is considered underpowered for Elk, Moose and Grizzly by today's standards.

i have to agree with kawa, my 270 has served me well. ive dropped about 10 pigs with it, Some big ole porkers. And a buck with it. I havent came across anything yet that the 270 wont take care of. I also have an 30 06 that has served me well. I would say find a friend with the rifles you like or go to a range and shoot the different rifles and see wich one u like better.

Fox 17, you have a PM

I wouldn't waste my time with a 270.I have a model 700 7mm.i have had it for 30 years have killed 97 deer,1 mule deer,3 elk,most of the deer were 300+ yrds,some 400+yrds.308 not a bad round i have a assault rifle in that round. 

what brand assult rifle? i would love a .308 like that.

i need some expert advice: which (.308 or 30-06) one of these shoots a flatter, longer trajectoyr (i think i screwed that word all up)? i am gonna get one of those calibers so i need the best most accurrate easiest to shoot one. im not worried bout where to get ammo. there are 3 gun shops pretty close and i frequently visit bass pro.

Here's the skinny on the 30-06 vs the .308 based upon both shooting a 150gr. boat tail accu-tipped bullet:

First, Velocity in feet per second:

Muzzle- .308 = 2820, 30-06 = 2910
100yrds - .308 = 2533, 30-06 = 2617
300yrds - .308 = 2009, 30-06 = 2083

Second, Energy in ft-lbs:

Muzzle - .308 = 2648, 30-06 = 2820
100yrds - .308 = 2137, 30-06 = 2281
300yrds - .308 = 1344, 30-06 = 1445

Third, long range tragetory based on 200yrd zero:

100yrds - .308 = +1.8", 30-06 = +2.0"
250yrds - .308 = -3.4", 30-06 = -3.2"
300yrds - .308 = -8.8", 30-06 = -8.2"


Hope this helps. Have a good one!

I highly recommend the M16A2 Service Rifle. 

Sir, the M16A2 Service Rifle is a 5.56mm Lighweight, Magazine Fed, Air Cooled, Gas Operated, Shoulder Fire Weapon, Capable of Firing Either Semi-Automatic or Three Round Burst.

The Maximum Effective Range of the M16A2 Service Rifle is 2682 feet at an area target, and 1604 feet at a point target.

Sir.


(http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/197/ai033003c3ta9.th.jpg) (http://img516.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ai033003c3ta9.jpg)

Oohrah!

well if you can get me one ill buy it.





thanks alot. where did you find that? very helpful.

Anoriginal, did i send you a pm about a assult rifle? i thought i did. if i didnt, let me know so i can send it again.

The skinny on 7mm Rem Mag Ballistics

Federal Premium 7mm Rem Mag 150gr Nosler

First Velocity:
muzzle        3110 fps
100yds       2913 fps
200yds       2724 fps
300yds       2544 fps
400yds       2370 fps
500yds       2203 fps

Second Energy:
muzzle       3221 ft-lbs
100yds      2826 ft-lbs
200yds      2472 ft-lbs
300yds      2155 ft-lbs
400yds      1871 ft-lbs
500yds      1617 ft-lbs

Third Drop w/200yd zero:
100yds      +1.3 inches
200yds          0
300yds      -6.0 inches
400yds      -17.3 inches
500yds      -34.9 inches

As you can see, the 7mm Rem Mag shoots flatter with more velocity, and thus, more energy, than either the .308 or the .30-06.  In fact, the 7mm Rem Mag has more velocity and energy at 500 yds than the other two have at 300 yards.  These results are for all three calibers firing a 150gr bullet.    Furthermore, IMO, the 7mm Rem Mag is an easier shooting round than either of the other two.  You would rarely find someone shooting 150gr in .30-06 or .308; usually up around 180gr and higher, where recoil becomes even more of an issue and ballistics, in some respects, fall off more rapidly.  You can find the ballistics for any caliber at the following link: 

http://www.federalpremium.com/ballistics/Ammo_Search.aspx?act=choose&firearm=1&s1=1 (http://www.federalpremium.com/ballistics/Ammo_Search.aspx?act=choose&firearm=1&s1=1)

Here's another interesting tip:

If you sight your scope for 0 at 75 feet, you will be pretty much zero'd in at 200 yards.  I'm not going to do the math for you here, but trust me it works.  For you doubting Thomas' out there that know a little more than basic math (think trigonometry and dynamics here), measure the distance from the bore of the rifle to the bore of the scope, calculate the angle at 75 feet and perform the calculations for 200 yards using the velocity and angle.  You will find that the bullet will be very close to zero (which represents the line through the scope bore) at that distance.  Certainly close enough to hit the kill zone of any game you're after.  Of course, nothing is better than time at the range dialing in your combination.  This technique is an excellent starting point.

thanks. with those ballistics i may look into them. thats pretty impressive. i could kill anything with that. i found a recoil pad that slips on and lengthens the stock a lil, and it is good cause my arms are really long compared to most people. i dont mind the recoil that much though. one shot dont hurt. it is sightin it in.

also, do them lasers that sight your gun for you work? they look cool. they seem like they would work. any ideas?

All three rounds are excellent all-pupose hunting ammo and will take down anything you might encounter in the Southeast and most anything in the lower 48.  There are as many opinions as there are hunters.  Without question, the .30-06 is the most popular round, mostly because it has been around nearly forever.  I was fortunate enough to be able to do numerous hunts using the 06 and 7mm Rem Mag side by side.  When it came time for me to lay my money down, I chose the 7mm.  You won't go wrong with either.  Good luck and happy hunting.

Fox17

The 30-06 and 7 mag are both great. You'll be happy with either. The 7mag has more kick. 150 or more grains makes little difference. Most guys I know, including myself shoot the 150gr in the 30-06 too. I have several 7mags and several 30-06s and have always found both to be excellent rifles. Digginfools comments are right on regarding the 7mag's prowess. It is a great round. He's also right on the money about the 75' sight in. It will put you very very close at 200yrds with a 7 - 7.62mm bullet.

Bottom line, buy what you can afford and what you enjoy. Some guys like the 7mag because there is no doubt it offers more distance than the 30-06. Some guys like the 30-06 because it saves more meat than the 7mag. The .308 saves even more than the 30-06.

Some folks swear by the .243. I don't. In fact, I do not allow .243's on any of my hunts I guide or at any of my hunting camps. The .243 was designed as a varmit round and that's what it is good for. Sure, lots of guys argue that they've never lost a deer with it or "if you're a good shot, the .243 is fine". Well, that's fine with me if they're happy. But you're not hunting with me with a .243. I've seen too many lost deer, spent too many hours on my hands and knees tracking wounded game through the woods as a result of a .243. Just my opinion and like digginfool said, there are as many opinions as hunters.

Buy a .270, .308, 30-06 or 7mag and you'll likely be happy for any type of hunting you'll do (deer, hogs, even elk). Just buy quality in both the gun and scope.

I couldn't agree more with Anoriginal's last statement; put more thought into the rifle and scope rather than the caliber.  Of the three (or even 4, if you are still considering the .270) we have spoke about, it's more about the quality of the scope and the time behind it that counts more than any other factor.  I would rather put a $700.00 scope on a $250.00 rifle than the other way around.  In regards to the 75 foot rule, he is correct in regards to it being true for the 7mm caliber but that is more a function of velocity than anything else.  Units of mass cancels out during the calculations and bullet diameter only figures into wind resistance, which for the difference we're talking about, is somewhat negligible even at these velocities.  Each of these calibers lose approximately 20% of their velocity (give or take a percent or two) at 300 yards.  The manufacturers have all made their 7mm rounds high velocity to make for a flatter trajectory, which most hunters want, particularly for long range shots such as when you are hunting elk.  To sum it up, it is velocity rather than caliber that dictates the distance you zero in near to have a zero at 200 yards.  For the .30-06 or .308, try zeroing in at 45-50 feet.  That should put you pretty close.  The reason for the shorter distance is that, relatively speaking, you are lobbing the slower bullet and need the higher trajectory to zero in at 200 yards.  In regards to meat damage, I have to agree to a certain extent.  I have seen terrible damage to shoulders when I have chosen to take a chest shot; holes big enough to nearly fit my fist through.  The damage from a .30-06 was more like I had shot it with an arrow; an exit wound barely larger than an inch or two.  I countered this by tending to make head or neck shots, particularly on long shots.  On long shots, it was more a function of ethics than anything else.  Aiming at the head resulted in a clean kill or a clean miss.  There is nothing worse than crawling through briars looking for a wounded deer that had run off to die.  Of course, if you have a trophy in front of you, you aim for the kill zone.  Otherwise, I'm just looking for the meat of a nice 2-year-old doe and I take the head shot.

what would the recoil be compared to a mossberg 500 12 gauge? thats the only thing holding me back from the 7mm rem mag. i wont be the only one shooting it so it needs to not be too hard. is there a place to find recoil energy?

Depends on what shell you're shooting.  I can go shoot trap and feel better than a session of checking the accuracy of the scope on my hunting rifle.  On the other hand, if I'm shooting 3-1/2" magnum turkey loads, I wouldn't want to shoot more than a couple times.  If recoil is an issue, go with the .270.  Personally, I think the 7mm Rem Mag kicks less than the .30-06 but Anoriginal disagrees.  One thing for certain, they both kick harder than a .270.  Be realistic with yourself; where are you going to hunt, what are you hunting for and how often are you going to hunt.  If you are buying the rifle for sport, don't do it.  You will find it to be a very expensive hobby.  These calibers run about $1.00-1.50 per trigger pull not to mention the $700-900 you'll spend on a decent rifle/scope combo.  It doesn't make any sense to have that kind of gun in the safe if you're not going to use it.  Buy a .22LR and plink away all day for a couple of bucks and sharpen your shooting skills to the max (which isn't a bad idea even if you buy a hunting rifle).  An AR15 (expensive) or an AK47 (not so expensive but extraordinarily durable) are also very cheap to shoot if the .22LR seems too mundane for your taste.

well i have shotguns and .22s for just shootin. i need a rifle to hunt with. not a hobby. strictly hunting. i wont shoot it too much. just sightin it in and if i see a animal. i would use a rifled shotgun and slugs but they are as much as a rifle and dont shoot far. im gonna hunt in the southeast. from texas to florida to tennessee to west viriginia maybe. georgia, florida definately. well see. it is a .308 or a 7mm.