Parents of boy killed on ATV suing maker

[JackL]

Parents of boy killed on ATV suing maker


By RANDY ROSS

Friday, September 07, 2007

The parents of a 9-year-old boy killed in an all-terrain vehicle rollover wreck have filed a wrongful death lawsuit in Wood County district court against Yamaha Motor Corp.

Jeremy Todd Crow Jr., or J.T. Crow, was a passenger on a Yamaha Rhino 450 in June, the lawsuit states. A "slow speed" turn caused the vehicle to roll, and the lawsuit claims the lack of vehicle doors resulted in J.T. being ejected from the vehicle even though he was wearing a seat belt. The boy was pinned underneath the vehicle, resulting in severe head trauma. He was pronounced dead at an emergency room in Jasper.

A call requesting an interview with the family and a call to the legal offices of Yamaha Motor Corp. for comment were not returned Thursday.

The lawsuit claims that the Rhino is "excessively prone to roll over during turns even at low speeds because of inherent flaws in its design," and that the boy's death and damages to his family were caused by the defective vehicle and corporate negligence.

"Yamaha has been aware for years of serious injuries and deaths of drivers and passengers in roll over accidents, yet has not modified the Rhino's design to correct for its stability problems," said attorney Fabrice Vincent of Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, a national law firm.

In August, Yamaha announced an offer to install doors and passenger hand-holds for the Rhino free of charge in response to the risk of injury during rollovers, according to a written statement from the Lieff Cabraser law firm.

Crow's parents, Jeremy and Heidi Crow, are seeking compensation for medical and funeral expenses, mental anguish, loss of companionship and loss of care and support J.T. Crow might have provided the family had he lived.

Texas ATV laws

— All all-terrain vehicle owners must apply for a title before selling or disposing of their ATVs.

— All ATVs operated on public property must be registered, renewing registration once every year.

— No passengers are allowed at any time while the ATV is on public lands, unless the ATV is designed to carry a passenger.

— ATV use on public streets is prohibited, except to cross these roads or for agricultural purposes.

— All operators younger than 14 must be accompanied by a parent or guardian.

— While on public lands, all operators must have a safety certificate or be with a parent who has obtained a safety certificate.

— ATVs shall not be operated from an hour after sunset to an hour before sunrise without a lighted taillight and headlight.

Texas ATV deaths

— Total reported deaths (1982-2005): 308

— Reported deaths (1982-2001): 221

— Reported deaths (2002-2005): 87

— Reported deaths of children under 16 (1982-2001): 89

[Ida_Mann]

stupid people shouldn't breed.

Id@

[Young Gun]

stupid people shouldn't breed.

Id@

Agreed 100%.  I hate hearing about these stories, its not the makers fault.  Its the parents.

[561rincon]

yeah but stats dont lie yamaha admited they were prone to roll but didnt change design therefor admiting fault by offering doors and handles free. but im sure it wasnt a slow speed roll like they claim but if it was your family and it was as they state low speed and it happened youd do the same atleast force them to build a better machine and recall the rest.   all IMO

[quadracer1992]

yeah but stats dont lie yamaha admited they were prone to roll but didnt change design therefor admiting fault by offering doors and handles free. but im sure it wasnt a slow speed roll like they claim but if it was your family and it was as they state low speed and it happened youd do the same atleast force them to build a better machine and recall the rest.   all IMO

I agree with that. If Yamaha knew it was prone to roll over, why not change the design, mabe lower its center of gravity so that it is not as top heavy. Then again though the owners should have dont a little research before putting their 9 year old, probably inexperience son, on an atv. Also, I wouldnt imagine that a seatbelt on an atv would be such a good idea, since it makes getting pinned under the quad a bigger threat. Even if the quad rolls, most experience riders would know to bail off before they get squashed under the quad.

[Young Gun]

I disagree with the two above.  Of course it's going to roll over at a point, look at its height to weight ratio.  They were probably zipping around and they guy decided to be funny and do a sharp turn.  He was probably inexperienced to.  Blame the driver, not the machine.  10:1 that family owns an SUV or something similar.  Everyone knows they are prone to rollovers, if they rollover in their SUV with a wellknown rollover risk are they going to sue the company?  I mean feel for the family, it would suck for something like that to happen and its tragic.  But the fact is they took the chance.  They let him ride knowing their was a chance of this happening.  I wonder if he had a helmet on?

[quadracer1992]

I agree with that for the most part but there are a lot of opinions but none of us were there so there is really no way of telling what happened or whos fault it was.

[Young Gun]

I agree with that for the most part but there are a lot of opinions but none of us were there so there is really no way of telling what happened or whos fault it was.

Very true, but I'm just going with the article for now. 

Kid was in the Rhino with no head protection (thats a given since most think "oh it has a rollcage thats fine")

Riding with a show-off inexperienced driver

Recipe for disaster. 

[backwoods boy]

obviosly he wasnt experienced enough w/ the machine all atvs utvs cars motorcycles etc handle differently and unless your experienced w/ that particular machine you should be VERY careful wear a helmet and just git the feel for it also if he wasnt used that certain kind of terrain is the same thing obviosly he wasnt familiar w/ atleast 1 or both of the above or he would have known the limit before it flipped

[quadracer1992]

When it comes down to it it really is the rider, and the parents should have done their research and known that the quad rolls over easily. Low speed to them might have been 20 mph for all we know, the article really doesnt say, so you cant necessarily blame the manufacturer, especially since Yamaha was honest and noted that the quad easily rolls over. The buyers need to do thei research thats all im saying.

[Ida_Mann]

"severe head trauma", I don't think there would have been severe head trauma if the kid had a helmet on unless it was a high speed incident in which they were going so fast that the kid was thrown out and smacked a concrete barrier or something, so my guess is no helmet.

stupid hurts, and unfortunately this family ignored common safety protocol and manufacturers warnings, and they are paying for it,,,,don't make the manufacturer pay for it.

Id@

[KB]

Id@, you know how SOME attorney's only see $$ signs, they salivate from the mouth at accidents like this.

It's crazy, like when you get into a car accident, ticket or DUI, your mailbox will be full for day's w/ there little post cards.

Off topic but,
I've had 2 cousins die, 1 (Jack Fields) was working at a UPS hub in Huntsville, AL., he would unload the big trucks/trailers into the building, those trailers get pretty hot so they had a metal fan on a pedestal that they would move from trailer to trailer, my cousin(18) musta been pretty sweaty/wet 'cause as soon as he touched that fan to move it, he grounded it & it fried him, the building UPS was in was an old building & none of the 110v receptacles had the hole for the ground so somebody broke it off the plug to plug it in(wasn't grounded).
He was a good Christian kid, didn't know what beer tasted like, his parents didn't want to sue for some reason, I think I would have.

My other cousin died on an ATC in MI. my Aunt didn't sue Honda either.

Both happened about 20, 25 yrs. ago.

I still ride ATC's, drives my Grandma crazy, & I'm real anal about all my extension cords having good plugs on them at work.

When it's your time to go, it's your time to go, you never know.

I say have as much fun as you can when your young, enjoy it while you can.

[illegal26]

My prayers go out to the little boys parents.

[Young Gun]

Off topic but,
I've had 2 cousins die, 1 (Jack Fields) was working at a UPS hub in Huntsville, AL., he would unload the big trucks/trailers into the building, those trailers get pretty hot so they had a metal fan on a pedestal that they would move from trailer to trailer, my cousin(18) musta been pretty sweaty/wet 'cause as soon as he touched that fan to move it, he grounded it & it fried him, the building UPS was in was an old building & none of the 110v receptacles had the hole for the ground so somebody broke it off the plug to plug it in(wasn't grounded).
He was a good Christian kid, didn't know what beer tasted like, his parents didn't want to sue for some reason, I think I would have.

Sorry to hear that about both your cousins.  In the case of the UPS incident, thats ok to sue in my opinion.  It was faulty equipment, not your cousin. 

[ROC0999]

wow this is a real unfortunate situation, the munufacturer is responsible to some extent only because they knew that their product was unsafe but so are the parents and driver for their lack of knowledge, my prayers also go out to the family for their loss of their son

[JackL]

"severe head trauma", I don't think there would have been severe head trauma if the kid had a helmet on unless it was a high speed incident in which they were going so fast that the kid was thrown out and smacked a concrete barrier or something, so my guess is no helmet.

I have had and seen my fair share of atv accidents, and I can only say their is no way to know without a first hand account.

stupid hurts, and unfortunately this family ignored common safety protocol and manufacturers warnings, and they are paying for it,,,,don't make the manufacturer pay for it.

I'm not sure I agree with this, one of the reasons I posted this story is because we have so many owners of these here, I was hoping to read some input from them. I guess they are all out riding...

[KB]

Jacks right, who knows what happened except for the people who watched it or if it was on film.

Maybe manufacturers can start putting litltle black boxes on ATV's like in airplanes to go back & see what happened ?

Feel bad for the kid & has family though.

[UncleRico]

They should really take a long hard look at banning ATV's and motorcycles. They seem very dangerous.

Does anyone want to start a group to BAN ATV's? We could have meetings with refreshments and what not.

Anyone?

[qt314nfla]

Jacks right, who knows what happened except for the people who watched it or if it was on film.

Maybe manufacturers can start putting litltle black boxes on ATV's like in airplanes to go back & see what happened ?

Feel bad for the kid & has family though.

I really don't think black women want to ride around on atv's all day.  Would they be big black boxes or little ones?  The manufacturers would have to make the bikes bigger to handle the extra badonkadonk.

[quadracer1992]

They should really take a long hard look at banning ATV's and motorcycles. They seem very dangerous.

Does anyone want to start a group to BAN ATV's? We could have meetings with refreshments and what not.

Anyone?

Do you want to get jumped?

[GrizzlyGator]

9 yr. old  NUFF SAID

Look this is just a guess here, but lets assume it was one of us, hard working, living pay check to pay check regular folk..who let their experienced youngster go ride out on the back 40 (there are plenty of us on here that do exactly that and God forbid they get in a serious accident) do you think with all the medical bills and or funeral expenses maybe one of us wouldn't try and reap some pay back??? Dunno just wonder out loud on the key board. 

[backwoods boy]

well i know theres stickers on all quads i think over 90cc that say 16 or older some even 18 or older so a 9 year old shouldnt have been drving 660 cc machine anyhoo

[UncleRico]

I haven't seen all the facts on the article, but shouldn't he be suing the helmet maker? I mean, surely the helmet should have prevented such major trauma to the head.

[Young Gun]

I haven't seen all the facts on the article, but shouldn't he be suing the helmet maker? I mean, surely the helmet should have prevented such major trauma to the head.

The helmet was invisible.

[JackL]

They should really take a long hard look at banning ATV's and motorcycles. They seem very dangerous.

Does anyone want to start a group to BAN ATV's? We could have meetings with refreshments and what not.

Anyone?

Considering the death toll in Florida is nearly 3x for boats & PWC at this time, I want to see those banned first.

I haven't seen all the facts on the article, but shouldn't he be suing the helmet maker? I mean, surely the helmet should have prevented such major trauma to the head.

This is a very easy conclusion to make based on emotions and other factors that don't really matter, but in the end it all boils down to luck IMO. For a child without a fully developed skull, it is a no brainer, but for a full grown adult it should be a choice. Lord knows I have bounced on my thick head many times with only minor brain damage.


--

ATV rollover kills Houston man
ALASKA DIGEST


Published: August 31, 2007
Last Modified: August 31, 2007 at 02:08 AM

HOUSTON -- A 21-year-old Houston man died Wednesday night when his all-terrain vehicle rolled over and threw him on a trail adjacent to the Parks Highway, according to Houston police.

Joshua Scott Cope was unresponsive when police arrived, said officer Jason Holmgren. Medics pronounced Cope dead at 10:45 p.m., according to a written police statement.

Cope and a friend were just out for a ride, Houston Police Capt. John Rhyshek said.

Cope's friend was out of ahead of him when Cope's Kawasaki ATV flipped, according to Holmgren. The friend saw a flash of lights from Cope's headlights as the ATV rolled, Holmgren said.

"He turned over his shoulder and saw that there was an accident," Holmgren said, but "didn't really see what happened."

Rhyshek said that evidence at the scene seemed to indicate Cope lost control going down an embankment into a patch of rocks. The ATV flipped into the bushes, leaving Cope to land in the rocks.

Although Cope was wearing a helmet, the state medical examiner who responded told police the cause of death was likely blunt force trauma to the head, Rhyshek said.


-- Anchorage Daily News

--
Boy killed after ATV he was driving rolls
Dies in father's arms on farm south of city

Wed Sep 5 2007

By Gabrielle Giroday and Joe Paraskevas



submitted photo
Graham Siemens died after the ATV he was driving hit a patch of uneven ground and rolled.   
 

   
 
An eight-year-old boy died in his father's arms Sunday after the all-terrain vehicle he was driving rolled over three times on a farm south of Winnipeg, RCMP said Tuesday.
Graham Siemens was at the controls of an ATV in the Rural Municipality of Morris, about 65 kilometres south of Winnipeg, police said.

Another family member and a friend were driving two other ATVs at the same time. Tuesday, the boy's father said the child was a devout Christian who had a strong faith and a love of God.

Although he said his family was devastated by the boy's death, Wes Siemens said he supported his child's use of ATVs.

"He was a very, very huge part of our family... Graham did have a relationship with Jesus Christ. Every evening, you could hear it in his prayer, talking with Jesus," said Siemens.

"You can tell yourself not be sad for him because he is in a better place... it would be worse if we didn't have the assurance of (God's) salvation.   
"If there's one message you can get out there, it's that everybody needs to be sure of where their soul is going when they're dead."

The child's ATV is believed to have hit uneven ground and rolled over, said RCMP Sgt. Davy Lee, commander of the RCMP's Morris detachment.

The boy was wearing a helmet at the time of the accident.

His father said that, while viewing the accident was difficult, he was glad he believed his son was in heaven. ATVs for children should not be prohibited, he said.

"I wish I could do some things differently... well, we chose to allow it," said Siemens, who said Graham was one of four children.

"I do know that (the children) enjoyed (ATVs) immensely, and to throw out a blanket statement that four wheelers and dirt bikes are terrible things, I would be very disappointed with that."

The boy was among family when he died, Siemens said.

"I saw him at the scene, I saw him on the ground, I saw him when his soul went out of his body," he said. "It was a terrible thing, I have an unbelievable pain for having lost my son." RCMP were called to the scene and transported the boy to Morris Hospital, where he was pronounced dead.

"People in the community are devastated by this," said Lee. "He was a young fellow. It's been devastating for the family," Lee added, "and it certainly has impacted this community."

The incident provoked an angry reaction from Mike Waite, executive director of Safety Services Manitoba, a private, not-for-profit organization that looks into road and occupational safety and training issues.

Waite said two years ago, Safety Services was part of a group that included police and licensing stakeholders that submitted a brief to the provincial government.

They asked the government to establish tougher standards around the licensing and training of drivers of off-road vehicles such as ATVs and snowmobiles, and the enforcement of any new legislation.

"It has not yet been acted upon," Waite said of his group's confidential brief.

Currently, anyone 14 years old and under can ride an ATV in the province, as long as there is supervision and the driver remains on private property, Waite said.

As soon as a driver reaches a road, he or she requires a motor vehicle driver's licence to continue.

Rules governing ATV use vary from province to province. Canada has the highest per capita use of ATVs in the world, according to 2004 data from the Canada Safety Council, a national not-for-profit safety organization. About 2.5 million Canadians ride ATVs and about 850,000 own one.

"A lot of people lose sight of the fact that this is a dangerous vehicle," Waite said. "It shouldn't be in the hands of children. They don't understand the risks."


gabrielle.giroday@freepress.mb.ca

joe.paraskevas@freepress.mb.ca


--


ATV accident leaves two dead last night
11:13 a.m.
August 27, 2007
 
GEORGIA – Police are investigating a fatal ATV accident, in which both passengers were killed, that occurred last night on Sand Hill Road.

Twenty-two year old Jared Germain, of Essex, was driving the ATV without a helmet; his passenger, 24 year old Lee Matot, of Fairfax, was wearing a helmet. Both men died as a result of colliding with trees, police said.

Police responded to the scene of the one-vehicle accident just after 10 p.m. where they found the ATV smashed up in the culvert off the north side of the road where Germain was pronounced dead at the scene. Matot was transported to Northwest Medical Center and was pronounced dead along the way.

Police are investigating the accident for factors including speed and alcohol, they said.

Anyone with information re: this incident is asked to contact the Vermont State Police, St. Albans Barracks at 524-5993.

 

--

Jessup ATV wreck hurts Delaware County boy, 9
BY DAVID FALCHEK
STAFF WRITER
09/03/2007

A 9-year-old boy visiting Northeastern Pennsylvania with his family to ride all-terrain vehicles suffered head injuries after being thrown from an ATV on Sunday.

 
The boy was admitted to Community Medical Center and required more than 100 stitches to his head.

The youth was riding in a former coal-mining area off Sunnyside Drive, said Jessup police Officer Paul Nardozzi.

About 12:30 p.m., the boy was driving the ATV as it hit a hole in the road that bounced him off the vehicle, Officer Nardozzi said. Although the boy was wearing a helmet, it was not fastened and flew off. The boy suffered several cuts and bruises, including a deep laceration to the back of his head, but was conscious, Officer Nardozzi said.

His parents were on hand. Because of the boy's age, police declined to release his name.

Under state law, only those 16 or older may operate an ATV.

The Jessup site, with winding dirt roads and rolling hills, has become so famous as an illicit ATV park that the boy's family traveled from the Philadelphia suburb of Wallingford, Delaware County, to buzz around the trails with scores of other enthusiasts.

As ATVs have become more common as recreational toys, Northeastern Pennsylvania - with vast tracts of abandoned coal lands and wooded acreage - has become a magnet for all-terrain enthusiasts.

In Jessup, Officer Nardozzi said some of the ATV tourists had created a campground complete with tents and grills. Portions of that property are owned by the Scranton Lackawanna Industrial Building Co., Daniel Siniawa and others. Some of the land along the Casey Highway is being reclaimed by SLIBCO to expand the Valley View Business Park.

State law says ATV owners can ride the vehicles only on their own property or, with permission from landowners, on other private property.

Even then, ATV operation must be permitted by local ordinances. There are some private ATV parks in the state and some state lands open to ATV use, but only on trails, not off-road.

The investigation is continuing. Officer Nardozzi said that while the ATV operators were trespassing, the land is not posted, so trespassing laws are unenforceable.

Contact the writer: dfalchek@timesshamrock.com
 
 
--


I could post a hundred examples either way, but all that would do is reinforce the fact that this is a really dangerous sport/hobby and probably should be banned like boating, driving, walking, bicycling, smoking, drinking, swimming, etc, etc...

[BIGREDTIDE]

ATV's aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

Children DO NOT possess enough of these to be riding these machines.  Heck....a large %'age of ADULTS don't either!!

Most injuries/deaths are due to inexperience, irresponsible riders doing excessive speed, riding beyond the machines intended use.

Sad but true....

[Bleedsblue]

It's sad to see anyone died riding an ATV or RUV. Do I think Yamaha is responsible...no. I've had my Rhino for a year and driven it pretty hard through all kinds of terrian, high speed turns, etc... and only came close to rolling it once and I was doing a doughnut at the time. Truth is if you drive it with common sense you'll be fine. Thier is an increase in risk of breaking ankles, legs with the Rhino simply because if they do roll over the operator tends to put thier leg out to stop it from falling...thus the need for the new doors.

When operating any RUV with a child inside there should be no reason to drive so wrecklessly that they could be tossed out of it. Hell I went I ride with another passenger regardless of age I tend to drive a bit slower. The blame should be placed on the driver of the Rhino not the manufacturer. What next start suing Smith and Wesson for manufacturering a weapon that can kill someone?

Bill

[BIGREDTIDE]

From the story's...it was the small child himself that was driving it.

GODspeed 'lil fella.

[WickedBanshee]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

[JackL]

When operating any RUV with a child inside there should be no reason to drive so wrecklessly that they could be tossed out of it. Hell I went I ride with another passenger regardless of age I tend to drive a bit slower. The blame should be placed on the driver of the Rhino not the manufacturer. What next start suing Smith and Wesson for manufacturering a weapon that can kill someone?

Bill

I believe this has been tried numerous times and fortunately failed. People in this country really need to learn about personal responsibility for their actions, and stop relying on lawyers so much to cover up their own issues. I blame it on junk food.

[greenmachine]

The minute Yamaha started offering free doors & handholds, they placed themselves liable. They will win this lawsuit.

[94Hardbody4x4]

The kid is an idiot. I can just imagine them all yelling and screaming with excitement while they just kept on the gas around the turn because they had daddy's $10,000 toy.

They didn't deserve to die but I hope their case fails miserably.

[JackL]

The minute Yamaha started offering free doors & handholds, they placed themselves liable. They will win this lawsuit.

I agree, but it doesn't make it right.

[BIGREDTIDE]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

Tell me where I noted that this would stop accidents....

ATV'S DO NOT wreck themselves.  PEOPLE wreck them.  This is when they (ATV'S) are dangerous as is with anything...gun, car, knife, etc.  YES accidents happen to experienced riders. WHY is that?  I'll tell you why...because the experienced rider rode beyond the machines and/or the rider's capabilities.

That UTV DID NOT kill the kid.  By it not having doors...DID NOT kill the kid.  Inexperienced child driving is unfortunately the result of the childs death.
Now if it were to come out that there was some type of mechanical failure (frame broke, steering linkage snapped, tire blew, etc.) causing the child to loose control....NOW this is dangerous whether your young/old, experienced/inexperienced.

The riding "we" choose to do is what brings danger to ourselves & the ATV/UTV we are riding.  The ATV/UTV doesn't go where it wants to, we direct it.
 

[561rincon]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

Tell me where I noted that this would stop accidents....

ATV'S DO NOT wreck themselves.  PEOPLE wreck them.  This is when they (ATV'S) are dangerous as is with anything...gun, car, knife, etc.  YES accidents happen to experienced riders. WHY is that?  I'll tell you why...because the experienced rider rode beyond the machines and/or the rider's capabilities.

That UTV DID NOT kill the kid.  By it not having doors...DID NOT kill the kid.  Inexperienced child driving is unfortunately the result of the childs death.
Now if it were to come out that there was some type of mechanical failure (frame broke, steering linkage snapped, tire blew, etc.) causing the child to loose control....NOW this is dangerous whether your young/old, experienced/inexperienced.

The riding "we" choose to do is what brings danger to ourselves & the ATV/UTV we are riding.  The ATV/UTV doesn't go where it wants to, we direct it.




kid was a passenger not driver. the family is saying manufacture knew they were prone to roll but no recall was issued if you buy your child a lil doll thats full of lead and the child dies. whos fault then. 95% of atv accidents are operators fault. you cant be so quick to judge with so lilttle info. until then i feel sorry for parents loss and hope they dont lose intrest in the sport. my 2 cents
 

[JackL]

ATV'S DO NOT wreck themselves.  PEOPLE wreck them.  This is when they (ATV'S) are dangerous as is with anything...gun, car, knife, etc.  YES accidents happen to experienced riders. WHY is that?  I'll tell you why...because the experienced rider rode beyond the machines and/or the rider's capabilities.

That UTV DID NOT kill the kid.  By it not having doors...DID NOT kill the kid.  Inexperienced child driving is unfortunately the result of the childs death.
Now if it were to come out that there was some type of mechanical failure (frame broke, steering linkage snapped, tire blew, etc.) causing the child to loose control....NOW this is dangerous whether your young/old, experienced/inexperienced.

The riding "we" choose to do is what brings danger to ourselves & the ATV/UTV we are riding.  The ATV/UTV doesn't go where it wants to, we direct it.

They call them accidents for a reason. Like anything, their are numerous examples of people with plenty of experience getting seriously injured or killed while acting in a totally safe and responsible manner, it is just how life works unfortunately.

I just recently had a crash that could have easily killed me, and I was doing nothing beyond my capabilities or experience blowing up a sand road after a rain storm like I have done thousands of times, this was just the first time I hit a wet spot and hydroplaned. It was pure luck I jumped up to find the bike on all fours and not on top of me, and didn't break my neck landing on my head about 40ft away from where I was thrown when the bike did a barrel roll or two.

Unless you never exceed 10 mph, stay away from EVERYONE else in the world and inside during thunderstorms it can happen to anyone IMO. It is pretty much like the only safe sex is none at all, but what fun is that?

[BIGREDTIDE]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

Tell me where I noted that this would stop accidents....

ATV'S DO NOT wreck themselves.  PEOPLE wreck them.  This is when they (ATV'S) are dangerous as is with anything...gun, car, knife, etc.  YES accidents happen to experienced riders. WHY is that?  I'll tell you why...because the experienced rider rode beyond the machines and/or the rider's capabilities.

That UTV DID NOT kill the kid.  By it not having doors...DID NOT kill the kid.  Inexperienced child driving is unfortunately the result of the childs death.
Now if it were to come out that there was some type of mechanical failure (frame broke, steering linkage snapped, tire blew, etc.) causing the child to loose control....NOW this is dangerous whether your young/old, experienced/inexperienced.

The riding "we" choose to do is what brings danger to ourselves & the ATV/UTV we are riding.  The ATV/UTV doesn't go where it wants to, we direct it.




kid was a passenger not driver. the family is saying manufacture knew they were prone to roll but no recall was issued if you buy your child a lil doll thats full of lead and the child dies. whos fault then. 95% of atv accidents are operators fault. you cant be so quick to judge with so lilttle info. until then i feel sorry for parents loss and hope they dont lose intrest in the sport. my 2 cents
 

I got info about the child driving from a link I read from JackL.  Sorry...that was ANOTHER 9 year old...got 'em mixed up. 

[BIGREDTIDE]

ATV'S DO NOT wreck themselves.  PEOPLE wreck them.  This is when they (ATV'S) are dangerous as is with anything...gun, car, knife, etc.  YES accidents happen to experienced riders. WHY is that?  I'll tell you why...because the experienced rider rode beyond the machines and/or the rider's capabilities.

That UTV DID NOT kill the kid.  By it not having doors...DID NOT kill the kid.  Inexperienced child driving is unfortunately the result of the childs death.
Now if it were to come out that there was some type of mechanical failure (frame broke, steering linkage snapped, tire blew, etc.) causing the child to loose control....NOW this is dangerous whether your young/old, experienced/inexperienced.

The riding "we" choose to do is what brings danger to ourselves & the ATV/UTV we are riding.  The ATV/UTV doesn't go where it wants to, we direct it.

They call them accidents for a reason. Like anything, their are numerous examples of people with plenty of experience getting seriously injured or killed while acting in a totally safe and responsible manner, it is just how life works unfortunately.

I just recently had a crash that could have easily killed me, and I was doing nothing beyond my capabilities or experience blowing up a sand road after a rain storm like I have done thousands of times, this was just the first time I hit a wet spot and hydroplaned. It was pure luck I jumped up to find the bike on all fours and not on top of me, and didn't break my neck landing on my head about 40ft away from where I was thrown when the bike did a barrel roll or two.

Unless you never exceed 10 mph, stay away from EVERYONE else in the world and inside during thunderstorms it can happen to anyone IMO. It is pretty much like the only safe sex is none at all, but what fun is that?

JackL...I understand accidents happen due to our negligence (?).  Your incident was your fault...not your ATV's.    .  Well this wasn't the 1000th time...it was the 1001st time and you let your guard down so to speak...glad you're okay though.   

Just to make sure....I'm not dogging anyone on here.  We just see things differently. 

[Bleedsblue]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

Anything can be dangerous in the wrong hands. A butter knife used the wrong way can still kill you. However if you ride an ATV responsibly, with common senese they aren't any more dangerous than any other vehicle out there. I've had one accident on an ATV and it was my fault not the ATV's. There are very few proven cases where and ATV alone caused an accident, if so it's due to a manufacturer or part defect just like the stuff you find in motor vehicles.

I fully sympathize with the family of the child but you have to be driving irresponsibly in a Rhino in order to roll it. It takes a sharp corner at 10+ MPH or a doughnut to roll these things when driving on flat ground. Anyone experienced knows this and drives within the limits of the Rhino. No different than ATV.

Bill

[BIGREDTIDE]

My avatar....it's a 600RR sportbike.  These sportbikes are very powerful & fast.  Some say dangerous.  You can SERIOUSLY get hurt on them....when you PUSH it near or too it's limits as I have done, since I ride it on the track.

On the other hand....I can ride it as slow, and easy-like just like pushing a newborn in a baby stroller.

Now do I ride it like that?  No I do not.  But they are engineered to be ridden hard, and I choose to do so, and accept ALL consequences in doing so.

The sport ATV's are made for faster riding.  The majority of utility/recreational ATV's are not made for fast riding, cornering, jumping....of that nature.  I know, I know...majority of owner's ride these beyond there intended use.  I own a '85 250 Big Red (3-wheeler), and I've ridden it WAY past what it's intended use is.  Thankfully I haven't wrecked it, but it could w/out a doubt happen.  But if I ever were to wreck it....that'll be why....NOT because "it's" dangerous. 

[JackL]

JackL...I understand accidents happen due to our negligence (?).  Your incident was your fault...not your ATV's.    .  Well this wasn't the 1000th time...it was the 1001st time and you let your guard down so to speak...glad you're okay though.   

Just to make sure....I'm not dogging anyone on here.  We just see things differently. 

I understand what you are saying, but I have seen so many stories from farmers and other people not using bikes for recreation and acting totally responsible to discount the accident factor. I think it does everyone a disservice to claim anything is totally safe if you act responsibly, because any number of things can happen beyond our control.

Now do I ride it like that?  No I do not.  But they are engineered to be ridden hard, and I choose to do so, and accept ALL consequences in doing so.

This is one thing we can agree on 100%.

[561rincon]

My avatar....it's a 600RR sportbike.  These sportbikes are very powerful & fast.  Some say dangerous.  You can SERIOUSLY get hurt on them....when you PUSH it near or too it's limits as I have done, since I ride it on the track.

On the other hand....I can ride it as slow, and easy-like just like pushing a newborn in a baby stroller.

Now do I ride it like that?  No I do not.  But they are engineered to be ridden hard, and I choose to do so, and accept ALL consequences in doing so.

The sport ATV's are made for faster riding.  The majority of utility/recreational ATV's are not made for fast riding, cornering, jumping....of that nature.  I know, I know...majority of owner's ride these beyond there intended use.  I own a '85 250 Big Red (3-wheeler), and I've ridden it WAY past what it's intended use is.  Thankfully I haven't wrecked it, but it could w/out a doubt happen.  But if I ever were to wreck it....that'll be why....NOT because "it's" dangerous. 

yes but if a bolt in the steering was prone to sheering and they knew it and you died from it would it be your fault. point is they knew of problems and didnt want to bite a loss some people ride hard some dont but if the family proves it was manu error then they are entitled to compensation.

[BIGREDTIDE]

My avatar....it's a 600RR sportbike.  These sportbikes are very powerful & fast.  Some say dangerous.  You can SERIOUSLY get hurt on them....when you PUSH it near or too it's limits as I have done, since I ride it on the track.

On the other hand....I can ride it as slow, and easy-like just like pushing a newborn in a baby stroller.

Now do I ride it like that?  No I do not.  But they are engineered to be ridden hard, and I choose to do so, and accept ALL consequences in doing so.

The sport ATV's are made for faster riding.  The majority of utility/recreational ATV's are not made for fast riding, cornering, jumping....of that nature.  I know, I know...majority of owner's ride these beyond there intended use.  I own a '85 250 Big Red (3-wheeler), and I've ridden it WAY past what it's intended use is.  Thankfully I haven't wrecked it, but it could w/out a doubt happen.  But if I ever were to wreck it....that'll be why....NOT because "it's" dangerous. 

yes but if a bolt in the steering was prone to sheering and they knew it and you died from it would it be your fault. point is they knew of problems and didnt want to bite a loss some people ride hard some dont but if the family proves it was manu error then they are entitled to compensation.

I don't consider "doors" a mechanical defect.  Doors alone won't save 'ya.  Heck...how big would the doors be on a UTV?  Not big at all...unless they actually made a full size door...not the little half door (2'x3')  It'd take doors, and at minimum a 4 point safety harness.  Even with that....if you didn't wear a helmet...you'd still be likely to have head injuries in a rollover (depending on speed and severity of impact), even broken arm from flying out if not holding on to something.

[KB]

This morning I cut myself while I was shaving, it hurt really bad  , I think there should be more warning labels on the pack of razors I bought, does anyone know an attorney that could help me ? 

[greenmachine]

ATVs aren't dangerous if ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. 

So ,ATVs aren't dangerous if ......ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training?  YOU ARE WRONG !!!!! Fact......ATVs ARE VERY DANGEROUS!!!! Accidents happen to the most experienced riders/drivers .I don't care who you are or how long you been riding or what you know !  IF you tell yourself ,your friends that don't know better or your children that ATVs are NOT dangerous then you are asking for trouble before they even get on!  Fact .....ridden/driven with common sense, maturity, responsibility, and experience/training. .....Will "help" prevent accidents from happening....Not stop them.  ATVs  will always be dangerous.....know that , tell your children and teach them to respect the potential danger.

Anything can be dangerous in the wrong hands. A butter knife used the wrong way can still kill you. However if you ride an ATV responsibly, with common senese they aren't any more dangerous than any other vehicle out there. I've had one accident on an ATV and it was my fault not the ATV's. There are very few proven cases where and ATV alone caused an accident, if so it's due to a manufacturer or part defect just like the stuff you find in motor vehicles.

I fully sympathize with the family of the child but you have to be driving irresponsibly in a Rhino in order to roll it. It takes a sharp corner at 10+ MPH or a doughnut to roll these things when driving on flat ground. Anyone experienced knows this and drives within the limits of the Rhino. No different than ATV.

Bill

If you are saying that a sharp turn at 10mph will cause one of these to roll over, then I know I wont ever own one. If this is true then the family should be compensated heavily. I ride lawn mowers that go faster than 10mph & do zero degree turns with no problems. That is a scary statement you made if true.

[JackL]

If you are saying that a sharp turn at 10mph will cause one of these to roll over, then I know I wont ever own one. If this is true then the family should be compensated heavily. I ride lawn mowers that go faster than 10mph & do zero degree turns with no problems. That is a scary statement you made if true.

I have seen some very unbelievable maneuvers on these things and a 10mph rollover isn't one of them!

[Bleedsblue]

If you are saying that a sharp turn at 10mph will cause one of these to roll over, then I know I wont ever own one. If this is true then the family should be compensated heavily. I ride lawn mowers that go faster than 10mph & do zero degree turns with no problems. That is a scary statement you made if true.

If riding solo or with an adult in the driver seat and a child in the passenger seat and you are doing about 10 MPH and yank the wheel to the right you could possibly roll it. I'm not talking about letting off the gas and making a casual turn I'm talking about a hard 90* turn to the right. Same turn going to the left is no problem. With two adults up front no problem. Granted I say this with 27" tires on mine with the shocks adjusted all the way up so a stock Rhino would be probably closer to 15 MPH for the same thing to happen. There are ATVs out there that would easily flip in the same conditions...again it all comes down to experience.

Not more than a couple of weeks ago I was following a group of riders doing 25-30 MPH through all kinds of terrain with no issues...however I know the limits of the Rhino, I know when to slow down, how the weight is distributed, not to make sharp turns at speed.

Comparing a Rhino to a lawn mower is apples to oranges. How many lawn mowers have 12" of ground clearance? How many stock lawn mowers can even get up to 10 MPH? Comparing the two is like comparing Bronco II and a Sedan. Just look at the Rhino common sense will tell you that it's top heavy and will have a tendency to be tipsy in the right conditions so you drive it accordingly.

Bill

[BIGREDTIDE]

If you are saying that a sharp turn at 10mph will cause one of these to roll over, then I know I wont ever own one. If this is true then the family should be compensated heavily. I ride lawn mowers that go faster than 10mph & do zero degree turns with no problems. That is a scary statement you made if true.

If riding solo or with an adult in the driver seat and a child in the passenger seat and you are doing about 10 MPH and yank the wheel to the right you could possibly roll it. I'm not talking about letting off the gas and making a casual turn I'm talking about a hard 90* turn to the right. Same turn going to the left is no problem. With two adults up front no problem. Granted I say this with 27" tires on mine with the shocks adjusted all the way up so a stock Rhino would be probably closer to 15 MPH for the same thing to happen. There are ATVs out there that would easily flip in the same conditions...again it all comes down to experience.

Not more than a couple of weeks ago I was following a group of riders doing 25-30 MPH through all kinds of terrain with no issues...however I know the limits of the Rhino, I know when to slow down, how the weight is distributed, not to make sharp turns at speed.

Comparing a Rhino to a lawn mower is apples to oranges. How many lawn mowers have 12" of ground clearance? How many stock lawn mowers can even get up to 10 MPH? Comparing the two is like comparing Bronco II and a Sedan. Just look at the Rhino common sense will tell you that it's top heavy and will have a tendency to be tipsy in the right conditions so you drive it accordingly.

Bill

Well said Bill.

Could a Rhino roll in a 10mph turn?  Depends on rider weight distribution, traction available, condition of terrain turn is being made.  Wouldn't take hitting a small bump/rut at slow speed to tip it...again with the right...or wrong conditions....depending on how you want to look at it. 

UTV & lawn mower?     Not even comparable.