Question ATV Laws - Small Claims

[savetheweb]

Hello... Looking for some info/advice..

I bought an ATV off here back in 2004' and sold it but now the new owners are taking me to small claims court as it seems the individual I bought it from stole it back in 2001? I had called the DMV before buying it and asked them what I need to do if buying an ATV from individual back in 2004 and they told me if he owned the bike previous to 2001 all I would need is a Bill Of Sale and to check the VIN on the FDLE web site which I did and came back clear.. So I bought the bike and got a clear FL title for it from the DMV?? I talked to the police and gave them the info from who I bought it from but guess he is long gone..

So now they are taking me to small claims court for there money back??

Any Help Ideas??

Thanks..

[gery350]

how could you get it titled in 2004 if it was stolen in 2001..?

[savetheweb]

Guess the VIN he gave me didn't match the bike.....

I had the ATV with me at the DMV and all they wanted/needed to see was the Bill Of Sale...

[gery350]

oh man you didnt check the vin to make sure it matched the bike?


dang. good luck.

[savetheweb]

Nope    figured was good as DMV cleared it for a title and FDLE was clean as well ..

Not like a car and VIN in the upper window shield ... Guy I sold it to guess did the same thing and just took the paperwork to transfer title to him... Then guess he took it to the shop and they saw it there when they ran it I guess story was from him?

So ended up both of us being victoms of this ATV but he wants all his $$ back and I can't locate the guy that sold it to me for my  money..... 

[yunt2ride]

You should have checked the vin on the quad to the bill of sale he gave you. I think they will win, the cops will get the quad and you will be out all your money. Even finding the person who sold it to you will not get your money back. It may get him arrested. Here is my story. I purchased one and then went home and had an officer friend of mine check the vin. It came back clear. A week later the lady found that it had been stolen and reported it. She got her quad back. I got the guy arrested and still to this day have not received a penny. I even got one of the persons other dirtbikes found. Not even a reward. I did not keep up with the case because it was not worth me missing a bunch of time off work to see that he has a judgement owed to me. I figured he did not have any money is why he was stealing and I would never get blood out of a turnip. I put it under lessons learned and watch out from then on.

[yunt2ride]

Just remember a bill of sale is not worth the paper its written on if it does not match the vin on the quad. Also keep in mind that if you purchase a quad used it should have a title unless its an older unit. If its a 2004 and the sellers do not have the title. It may be theirs but there could also be a lien at the bank on it also. The bank can repossess it if it has not been paid in full and lien released.

[savetheweb]

Bike was a 2000' model that is why I called the DMV previous to buying it to see if titles were done back then and they said NO, all I need from the owner is just a Bill Of Sale with the ATV Owners Name/ Address/ Bike VIN is all I need to bring to them... Which is what I did.... I mean I had the bike there at the DMV as well when I took the Bill of Sale and they said didn't need to see it..

[UncleRico]

You made a Bonafide Purchase in good faith.

You had your ATV titled through a state agency without making any attempt to defraud or misrepresent the purchase.

A judge would be hard pressed to hold you accountable for fraud.

In this case, you have two parties who are both victims, and one of those parties is suing the other party. The perpetrator of the fraud is who should be held accountable, and as you deem him "long gone", one would be hard pressed to find you guilty, if you in fact have done all in your power to identify the perpetrator and provide all pertinent information to law enforcement.

Now, if you go before Judge Joe Brown, he'll probably toss the case, but if it goes before Judge Judy...hang on to your hat son..you might be in for a rocky ride.

[savetheweb]

Thanks  UncleRico just my thoughts exactly...

Gave all the information to police they "hunted" him down from what I have found in the police reports and think he was put in jail... So I can't cross claim him for this small claims court from Jail and tried to work it out with the Plantiff but they think they are the only victims here... 

So instead have to waste a judge's time and our taxes in court now over this...

[FordForever]

How lame is that...I hope you win.

[FishaHallic]

What was the guys screen name you bought it from and how much did you pay?

[AintSkeered]

Pure and simple! You bought and sold stolen property. That's a crime. You have no right to expect your buyer to assume any losses and you owe him a complete refund. You are lucky he's only taking you to court.

[savetheweb]

As for selling stolen property AintSkeered   DIDN'T know ATV was stolen so I didn't sell anything stolen was the guy I bought it from on here that stole it and who is in Jail by now... So no luck at all for me there I was the victom and was given title by the state so technically as the lawyer told me we are both the victoms and would have to go after the guy that sold it or work it out on our own if we wanted to, but will let the judge decide since the law is on my side and I did all that was needed when I bought it...

[savetheweb]

What was the guys screen name you bought it from and how much did you pay?

I had all the profile info printed off from this site back then when it was bought for the police so think they used alot of that to track him down what the report said.. So had name, location, email etc which helped them I believe....

[yunt2ride]

You said the guy you purchased it from is long gone. Now you are saying he is in jail. I think you owe the person you sold it to a refund and then keep up with the guy in jail and get a judgement against him. You can go to court when his court date is set and let the judge know how much you are out and he will put a judgement against him. They are asking or sueing you for their money back and you need to do the same to the person you purchased it from.

[Loven It]

You said the guy you purchased it from is long gone. Now you are saying he is in jail. I think you owe the person you sold it to a refund and then keep up with the guy in jail and get a judgement against him. You can go to court when his court date is set and let the judge know how much you are out and he will put a judgement against him. They are asking or sueing you for their money back and you need to do the same to the person you purchased it from.

I agree with you on this Yunt..Unfortunatley you were sold stolen merchandise..then you sold stolen merchandise (technical term is dealing in stolen property Felony offense), you got put in a really bad spot. I was in a situation (kinda) similar to this. I was 18 pawned something for a friend of mine who was 17. In short it was stolen..I did not know he stole it..they didn't go after him they went after me...I got in a whole lotta trouble and they did nothing to him. Later on a police report showed up for a burglary - charges were dropped on him since I was already charged with the theft part. I was already in trouble and the REAL VICTIM got their merchandise back from the pawn shop. I was innocent...judge did not care. I pawned/sold stolen merchandise. I hope this all turns out well for you...i would avoid court with the people who are coming after you - give them thier money back and go after they guy in jail. Like aintskared said even though you did not know it was stolen you are very lucky because you could techinally be put in jail for it.

I feel bad for you that you are in this situation but you are not the REAL VICTIM. There is someone out there who is missing their quad that was probably still making payments on a bike they no longer have. I hope the people who got their quad stolen originally get it back. 

You might be able to help others if you post the guys former screen name, so someone else dosen't get burned. ONCE A THEIF ALWAYS A THEIF!!!!! Please post the screen name.

[savetheweb]

You said the guy you purchased it from is long gone. Now you are saying he is in jail. I think you owe the person you sold it to a refund and then keep up with the guy in jail and get a judgement against him. You can go to court when his court date is set and let the judge know how much you are out and he will put a judgement against him. They are asking or sueing you for their money back and you need to do the same to the person you purchased it from.

In jail is long gone from real world and court system as a cross claim in this case was told by attorney... 

Well that is what I'm going to let the judge decide on how to come to a conculsion since we are both victims in this case and law will show that..... As for giving them there money back no problem soon as I get mine back might not be fair to all but that is the legal system. Told them not trying to make money and would split both our losses since the real criminal can't be brought forward for monetary and if was be a long day for sure before saw money from that creep prob....

I mean I did what FL DMV asked me when buying this ATV and look back and never should have bought a ATV if was going to cause this headache down the line..

[savetheweb]

You might be able to help others if you post the guys former screen name, so someone else dosen't get burned. ONCE A THEIF ALWAYS A THEIF!!!!! Please post the screen name.

Will POST his screen name/email when get home tonight indeed.....

As for turning out well been no real issues worked with the police here and the ATV was given back to original owners luckily not sure if they were around since the report said it was stolen back in 2001' Sure they were shocked and happy indeed with that call...

[yunt2ride]

Seems like you did not need any help from this website after all, since it seems you have already talked to a lawyer and decided what you were gonna do. The moral thing to do would be give them the money back because you made a mistake by not looking at the vin when you purchased the quad. I think they will and hope they win this one. Its what is do to them. You should have checked the vin on the quad. Final answer.

[savetheweb]

Seems like you did not need any help from this website after all, since it seems you have already talked to a lawyer and decided what you were gonna do. The moral thing to do would be give them the money back because you made a mistake by not looking at the vin when you purchased the quad. I think they will and hope they win this one. Its what is do to them. You should have checked the vin on the quad. Final answer.

Yunt-- Well was looking to see if anyone else has been in this situation which it seems there has been... As for them winning pretty cut and dry from a Legal stance have been told.... Was just doing what I could so both win since we really both are losing out in the end...

Out of curiousity how many people check VIN when you buy vehicle.. I mean first time ever bought an ATV but have bought cars, boats, golf carts and NEVER had issues there...

So guess just put this out there for a survey ....

HOW many people actually look for the VIN when you have either a Bill of Sale or a Title from the buyer?

[gery350]

dude im sorry but i ALWAYS check the vin.
i have 4 bikes and ive always cross referenced the vin to the title before showing the green.

tough lesson but i am sure you will check from now on.
hope it all works out.

[savetheweb]

dude im sorry but i ALWAYS check the vin.
i have 4 bikes and ive always cross referenced the vin to the title before showing the green.
tough lesson but i am sure you will check from now on.
hope it all works out.

Gery--- Yea learned well, now always check VIN to paperwork as well as get sellers DL number anytime I purchase anything........ If that is an issue for them no deal for me and I walk away......

[gery350]

yeah people call me paranoid but f that.
ont time iwas gonna drive to tampa to buy a z400(04) with only a billof sale.
the guy tried to convince me that those ORV's didnt have titles and a BOS would suffice.
well he finally broke down and told me that the bank had the title cause he still owed money on it.
BUT promised me that  he would pay it off with the money i gave him for the bike.
yeah right.

[savetheweb]

yeah people call me paranoid but f that.
ont time iwas gonna drive to tampa to buy a z400(04) with only a billof sale.
the guy tried to convince me that those ORV's didnt have titles and a BOS would suffice.
well he finally broke down and told me that the bank had the title cause he still owed money on it.
BUT promised me that  he would pay it off with the money i gave him for the bike.
yeah right.

Yea bought a JetSki that way actually but instead of giving him the Cashiers check for the money we went to the Dealer and gave it them to pay of the ski and he had the rest in his pocket..

Told me the same story and was like NOOOOOO wayyyy buddy I am paying the loan off for you then you get the change only way making this sale to me... Worked out though.........