Does God exist? This thread is not meant to be a debate!

[trx#9]

go sell crazy somewhere else , we have enough here already

  lol'

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

go sell crazy somewhere else , we have enough here already

 Tony and trx,  I have been whiteness to several miracles in reference to healing and answered prayers. My wife and I had lost our first attempt at having as child due to a miscarriage, it was the most painful thing we had ever been through including the loss of my father. I have been whiteness to his answered prayer, see my Father was given 3 months to live and on his deathbed he prayed to God to let him live to see me grown and married. My Father passed away 11 years later, two days after he was best man at my wedding he went into the hospital and died 3 weeks later. That is one miracle you cannot question. The most incredible thing I have witnessed is our 2nd attempt at getting pregnant my wife told me before we even knew, that she felt she was pregnant but it was for the glory of God. We found out she was pregnant a week later. When Colton our new born son was just 5 months old he stopped smiling and laughing in fact he stopped doing just about anything. Colton then started having seizures and we found out at all children's hospital the he had a rare and crippling disease called infantile spasm and it only effects 2 out of every 10,000 births. The prognosis was extremely grim as the told us Colton has a small chance, 4% of these children die, 70% have severe brain damage, 21% need full time care and 5% come out with mild learning disabilities. The dr's told us Colton's brain was atrophied and he would most likely need therapy just to learn to walk brush his teeth ect. Through prayer from thousands of people in this country from one coast to the next including several "crazy" as you have labeled them, people from this site we received a miracle. my wife reminded me that Colton would be fine, she reminded me of her feeling before we knew she was pregnant...that it was for Gods Glory and Colton would be a testament to the mercy of or Lord and how through Jesus and his stripes Colton would be healed. Dr. after Dr. and specialist after specialist no one could explain why this had happened and called it "idiopathic" see no one knew why he was having seizures. Through a prayer list that Colton was on a man from Orlando found my mother and explained that he could help her grand son. This man looked at a photo of Colton and told my mother that the problem was on Colton's left side of his brain, no Dr' had told us this only a man that claimed he had been dead for 5 minuets and after coming back has the gift of healing through Jesus Christ. My mother told me of this man and I dismissed him as a "wacko" looking for money and I was going to stick with the Dr.s, this was on Tuesday. I never told my wife of this man or about what he said. On Wednesday we took Colton to his neurologist in Tampa and when the Dr's sat down he told us they have fount the problem and it was on the left side of his brain...I almost hit the floor and tears welled up just as they are now in my eyes. After leaving the Dr's office I told my wife of the conversation I had with my Mother and she wanted to meet this man names Thom. I called my Mother and the man agreed to drive down free of charge to Sebring to see Colton on that Thursday @ 2:30 pm, From that point on our son Colton has laughed smiled talked and even walks with no therapy no more treatment and no more Dr's he is now 13 months old. Colton is our Angel and to see your son smile and do the things he was never to be able to do warms my heart every day.  I have been blessed with an amazing gift of being able to whiteness for our Lord and tell people of his mercy, I could not let this moment pass with out sharing it with you. I hope this has in some way touched your heart and opened you eyes. God bless you and when God shows himself in your life, embrace it please.

[Loven It]

Swamp - I was waiting for you to share your miracle again!

Me..I beleive in God and am very proud of it!!!  Why we too have had several situations that if it weren't for prayers who knows how the situations would have come out. My father has been DOA 2x's in his life: 1st time was a heart attack at work no one knew it even happened, 2nd time he was hit by a drunk driver going the wrong way on the interstate. His arm was almost completely severed - held together by a vein. My father has also had throat cancer and was just feeling better from that when the car accident happened.

Ask me how could I keep the faith when it seemed like nothing good was ever going to happen to dad - I started to loose faith, but kept on praying.  I often said to myself if there is a God why do you let this happen to my dad all the time. It didn't seem fair for one person to have to go through so much pain. The car accident was the last thing that happened to dad - during his recovery he told me "there is a reason I am still here and God isn't ready for me to go yet" dad also said "i have no idea why I am still here-guess I'll find out one day". I joked and told dad it was because I still needed him more than he would ever know (my father is one of my best friends-daddy's little girl even as an adult). In short about a 4-5 mths later I told dad I was pregnant. The day my son was born dad told me "this is the reason I am still here-you guys need me". Needless to say I ended up a single mom and my father is the closest thing to a dad my son has!! I have always been told that the Lord works in mysterious ways - seems like things happened to dad when the family was going through tough times and these situations brought our family together every time. Maybe the lesson we were being taught was not to take family for granted you never know when someone is going to be taken from you!

Do i still question my faith..I will be honest sometimes I do!  Why because I pray all the time nothing more will happen to our family and yet my brother has been recently diagnosed with MS at 31yrs old. I pray every night that each day my brother wakes up this will not be the day he is permanently put in a wheel chair - so far he is he still walking! So do prayers work - I think our family shows they can and do!!

So maybe its not my faith I question as much as its why these things keep happening to my family - because i really beleive pray is what has gotten us through these situations each time! 

Sorry this was so long...I was just trying to show that pray can and does work.

[VForcedave]

These are some real powerful testimonies. When the lord speaks you do not just listen with your ears. Thanks for sharing.

[Inyourdraft2000]

Those are definately great testimonies. My wife and I share a very similar one w/ the birth of my son.
We went into the hospital w/ the notion that she had another round w/ kidney stones and after several hours of the hospital being confused w/ results that were mixed up w/ another patients paperwork we were told that she was pregnant. The kicker is that they were strongly incouraging her to take some medicine that would help her pass the egg as they said that it considered doomed.
We both immediately agreed that if it were to be a doomed egg that it would be in Gods hands and not the Doctor. You should have seen the look on the Doctors face when I returned to that hospital a year later w/ my son and showed him the differance between his doomed egg and Gods Miracle.
He is 10 years old and other then breaking his leg on his 10th birthday he is as healthy as any kid.
These kind of stories could fill up this forumn really fast if everyone posted their stories and I know that some wish not to believe and that is their perogative.
I have heard many stories about eye witness accounts of angels at work but I have recently got to see one for myself w/ me and my friend riding 4 wheelers together. We were goofing off on my property racing across the field and when we would come close to the end we would back out of the throttle and set up for the turn well after a few times my friend decided he was not going to get beat again and did not back out of the throttle in time. He like a dummy locked up his breaks andturned side ways and Flipped or was thrown from his bike. Now picture this as he was flying through the air about 6 feet off the ground his momentum was in the direct path of a huge oak tree on the corner of the property. By simple laws of physics he by all rights should have hit the tree head on w/ out his bike mind you. While he was going through the air I was behind him and witness his body take a curve ball fade to the left side of the tee. It was so shocking because the first thought in my mind was OH Crap.
Someone call and ambulance. Then the next thing you know he was picking him self up off the ground and never touched the tree. The only thing that could have pushed him left was an Angel because there was no wind blowing my friend.I ask him how and the world did he not hit the tree and he was in total shock and checking his pants.
Well there could be many more to tell but I will shut up now. Good to see and read/hear the above testimonies and Thank God that he still works in so many ways.

[trx#9]

I'm glad everything work out fine in your storys, they were all amazing recoverys. Things like this happen all the time though. In my opinion prayer gives confidence in some people and thats all they need sometimes, positive thinking works for instance if you are positive about an interview you'll do better than feeling negitive about it. Same thing with sickness too. There's a lot of miracles that happen without prayer, probably just has many or more. To think thats there's a person (Jesus or god) sitting on a cloud, sky or what ever answer prayers to 6 billion people on earth is crazy. The chances of this happening are slim to none your number on your ticket might say 2,867,256,806. They just had a story on this on fox news about a survey that was done about the power of prayer, the survey showed that prayer didn't live up to the hype and showed no real benefits to there cause. You can read about this on the website fox 13 don't no the actual web address or if its still on there you can try if you want. Its funny how religious people always claim anything great that happens is a miracle from god and when things go bad you don't here anything from them. I recall about 5 years ago a outbreak of tornado's in alabama one hit a church were people were at sunday mass, 12 died and many were severely injured. That was in a house of god, I guess he was tired serving 6 billon people.    

[Inyourdraft2000]

You know what, your right, what was I thinkng anyway. Its a hole lot easier to think that I was part of the evolution that started from some parasite then grew into a minow then turned into a snake and later grew arms and legs, then some how decided it was time to turn into a dinosour but along the way not all of us became dinosours and some became monkeys and found their way to be cavemen who then decided to kill off all the dinosours and after dragging my cavewomen around by her hair all day decided I'd get an education and become Donald Trump and build huge buildings every where so the whole world can see how wealthy I became after I got tired of carrying my old lady around.
Thanks to you for helping me see that there just is no such thing as God and Prayer. Slap me silly for being so ignorant all this time. As you are descending into hell for your decision to reject Christ please remember that you had the choice before it ever came to this."Dear God, help them, send someone there way that can show them the way before its too late
Contrary to some popular belief, no one has ever been kicked out of Hell for Peddleing Ice Water or for trying to take over.
Well its been fun thus far, ttyl

[LeBlanc Outdoors]

Does love exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait you can see how it affects us.
Does wind exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait you can see how it affect everything around it.
Does hate exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait, how it affects us all.

Does GOD exist? Can't see him, can't place your hands where the spear pierced his side, easy to dismiss as we attempt to place him in our human understanding.  As I posted before he will touch each and every one of us at some point in our lives, you won't see him, or touch him, but I guarantee you you will know he is there.

Bad things can and do happen to people of Faith, God has given us free will and sorrow and pain will occur, and we might not understand why, and feel GOD is not present with us at those times. Oh no, feelings no scientific reason for there being, I guess they don't exist.

Live, Love and laugh often. Life is a gift, cherish every day and every smile.  Gods greatest gifts are Faith, Hope and Love. And the greatest of these is Love.  Can't see 'em, can't touch 'em, Hope to get to share all of them with as many of you as possible.  See you on the trail and in the mud.  The Polaris is always ready for tow duty, or sometimes in need to be towed.

May God Bless Us All!!!   Jeff and Family

[Chuck_Norris]

You know what, your right, what was I thinkng anyway. Its a hole lot easier to think that I was part of the evolution that started from some parasite then grew into a minow then turned into a snake and later grew arms and legs, then some how decided it was time to turn into a dinosour but along the way not all of us became dinosours and some became monkeys and found their way to be cavemen who then decided to kill off all the dinosours and after dragging my cavewomen around by her hair all day decided I'd get an education and become Donald Trump and build huge buildings every where so the whole world can see how wealthy I became after I got tired of carrying my old lady around.
Thanks to you for helping me see that there just is no such thing as God and Prayer. Slap me silly for being so ignorant all this time. As you are descending into hell for your decision to reject Christ please remember that you had the choice before it ever came to this."Dear God, help them, send someone there way that can show them the way before its too late
Contrary to some popular belief, no one has ever been kicked out of Hell for Peddleing Ice Water or for trying to take over.
Well its been fun thus far, ttyl

 

here a couple of questions:
Why do the believers have a such a hard time with the non-believers in their feelings?
why do i have to be wrong and them right, when actually no one can prove either? (don't tell me because the bible sez so, lots of books say lots of things)
why do they feel they need to try and convert someone whether or not they want to be converted?
in the end...what does it matter to anyone else what I do/do not believe in?



i dont try to convert anyone! if my lifestyle is appealing to them and they ask, then i will tell, if not then life goes on.
Q #1.  i have no idea
Q#2. thats easy.........we all want to be right
Q#3. they want to try and help a friend get saved. they should stop trying until you show interest or they will just push you away.
Q#4. it doesnt matter to me what you believe in. i will still ride with you and help you in anyway, what better way for me to show GOD that i want to help.
thank you for not attacking me with your reply, as i hope i did not attack you

well said!!

Does love exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait you can see how it affects us.
Does wind exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait you can see how it affect everything around it.
Does hate exist? Can't see it, can't smell it, can't touch it. I guess it doesn't exist. Oh wait, how it affects us all.

Does GOD exist? Can't see him, can't place your hands where the spear pierced his side, easy to dismiss as we attempt to place him in our human understanding.  As I posted before he will touch each and every one of us at some point in our lives, you won't see him, or touch him, but I guarantee you you will know he is there.

Bad things can and do happen to people of Faith, God has given us free will and sorrow and pain will occur, and we might not understand why, and feel GOD is not present with us at those times. Oh no, feelings no scientific reason for there being, I guess they don't exist.

Live, Love and laugh often. Life is a gift, cherish every day and every smile.  Gods greatest gifts are Faith, Hope and Love. And the greatest of these is Love.  Can't see 'em, can't touch 'em, Hope to get to share all of them with as many of you as possible.  See you on the trail and in the mud.  The Polaris is always ready for tow duty, or sometimes in need to be towed.

May God Bless Us All!!!   Jeff and Family

With American turning  its back on GOD how else would you explain the moral errosion of our great country. We are heading towards a modern day Soddom and Gamora

[Joedirt]

Soddom and Gamora?....Take it easy

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

Soddom and Gamora?....Take it easy

He said SODDOM not SODOMY Dont get exited Dirt.

[tony pitts]

Sorry trx9 i was out of town last night and missed all the excitement. no matter what we say or how we say it, according to all these so called christians, we're going to hell cause we are bad people for having our opinions.  and another thing, there is more proof we came from evolution  than there is that we came from adam and eve.  By the way, if there were adam and eve and they had two sons, where did everyone else come from....  sounds like a little insest going on there

[LeBlanc Outdoors]

Sorry trx9 i was out of town last night and missed all the excitement. no matter what we say or how we say it, according to all these so called christians, we're going to hell cause we are bad people for having our opinions.  and another thing, there is more proof we came from evolution  than there is that we came from adam and eve.  By the way, if there were adam and eve and they had two sons, where did everyone else come from....  sounds like a little insest going on there

    Actually I never said or even implied you or anyone else is going to Hell.  No person Christian or otherwise has the right to pass judgement on the state of your salvation.  And as far as that goes, I AM a Christian not a so called Christian.
    Now lets address your statement that there is far more scientific proof supporting evolution over creationism, is nothing more than completely without merit.   Evolution is based solely on the theories of Charles Darwin.  Darwin was not a scientist, had only one advanced degree which was a BA in Theology, yes Theology.  Darwin recanted his position on evolution as he stated in his original papers that unless multitudes of transitional species were found, his work had to be considered flawed and false, to date NO transitional species have ever been discovered, not 10, not 1, NONE.  It seems some have latched on where Darwin bailed off, with or without any basis.    Yet current DNA studies seem to show that all DNA strings point back to a single maternal beginning. HMMM. 
     Yes I feel qualified to expound on these subjects, I hold Degrees in Theology and Divinity and am an Ordained Minister, and researched heavily on the Patriarcal Church and Creationism vs Evolution in my studies.   I am happy to discuss any subject in this realm in a open honest manner.  I don't believe you see myself, Chuck or Dreth looking down on anyone, or attempting to comment on yours or anyones state of salvation.   Looking forward to riding with all of you.        Yours in Christ,  Jeff+

[Ida_Mann]

It is the belief of people who are saved that people who are not will never truely participate in the joy that comes with being saved, the everyday miracles that are noticed by a believer are what gives them the eyes and ears to notice a non-believer and try to turn them towards their way of life.

Please don't try to hold it against believers for trying to "convert" someone when they find out how wonderful they feel on the "saved" side.

Ask youreself this, how many times have you tried to get a friend who doesn't ride to go riding with you?  It's the same concept,,,,,you know about something wonderful(riding) and they don't yet so you want to show them how great it can be.

Id@

[trx#9]

Sorry trx9 i was out of town last night and missed all the excitement. no matter what we say or how we say it, according to all these so called christians, we're going to hell cause we are bad people for having our opinions.  and another thing, there is more proof we came from evolution  than there is that we came from adam and eve.  By the way, if there were adam and eve and they had two sons, where did everyone else come from....  sounds like a little insest going on there

    Actually I never said or even implied you or anyone else is going to Hell.  No person Christian or otherwise has the right to pass judgement on the state of your salvation.  And as far as that goes, I AM a Christian not a so called Christian.
    Now lets address your statement that there is far more scientific proof supporting evolution over creationism, is nothing more than completely without merit.   Evolution is based solely on the theories of Charles Darwin.  Darwin was not a scientist, had only one advanced degree which was a BA in Theology, yes Theology.  Darwin recanted his position on evolution as he stated in his original papers that unless multitudes of transitional species were found, his work had to be considered flawed and false, to date NO transitional species have ever been discovered, not 10, not 1, NONE.  It seems some have latched on where Darwin bailed off, with or without any basis.    Yet current DNA studies seem to show that all DNA strings point back to a single maternal beginning. HMMM. 
     Yes I feel qualified to expound on these subjects, I hold Degrees in Theology and Divinity and am an Ordained Minister, and researched heavily on the Patriarcal Church and Creationism vs Evolution in my studies.   I am happy to discuss any subject in this realm in a open honest manner.  I don't believe you see myself, Chuck or Dreth looking down on anyone, or attempting to comment on yours or anyones state of salvation.   Looking forward to riding with all of you.        Yours in Christ,  Jeff+

So his work was flawed and false, like the bible.

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

It is the belief of people who are saved that people who are not will never truely participate in the joy that comes with being saved, the everyday miracles that are noticed by a believer are what gives them the eyes and ears to notice a non-believer and try to turn them towards their way of life.

Please don't try to hold it against believers for trying to "convert" someone when they find out how wonderful they feel on the "saved" side.

Ask youreself this, how many times have you tried to get a friend who doesn't ride to go riding with you?  It's the same concept,,,,,you know about something wonderful(riding) and they don't yet so you want to show them how great it can be.

Id@

Nice Id@  very well put sir!!!

[LeBlanc Outdoors]

OK, lets talk about reliability and authenticity of literature.   People in general think most philisophical lituature is accurate and authentic ie: Plato, etc.  Yet by commonly used standards used by researchers (scientists) the most reliable and accurate book is the Bible.   As I am sure you know the Bible is a copulation of many books comprising the basis, history. theology and mores of the Judeo Christian ethic and civilization of the 5000 or so years.  Secular writings of the time consistantly co-oberate Biblical parallel books.   Now after the time of Christ, (sidenote: Christ never promised us a book, only a church, he never left us any writtten material, we are told of writings in the sand only, it is the Church which gives us the inspired book through authority bestowed upon the Church by Christ with the guidance of the Holy Spirit)  literally thousands of writings were present to the early believers, the New Testament as we know it started to take shape in the second and third centuries with the Canon being set at the Third Council of Hippo in 363ad and affirmed at the Third Council of Cartage in 397 ad.  The Church also commissioned St. Jerome during this period to translate the Greek Old Testament and closed Canon of the New Testament in the Latin Vulgate, as this was the universal language of the time(much like English is used in all flight towers).
So if you wish to discount Biblical authority and authenticity it is your perogative, if you wish to look at it as a fictional account of men, again go for it.  I will tell you, if you ever decide to venture toward honestly reading and investigating what it has to say, be careful, it has the propensity to draw you in to investigate more deeply.
   Many try to discredit biblical teaching by taking small snipits or phrases out of context or out of the literary style they were written. Apocalyptic Wrirtings such as Daniel, Revelations were written in literary code so to speak, as the secular humanist society of the times would persecute, torture or kill openly Christian persons of the period.  The Bible is a big picture book.(That picture being salvation history)

In the desire to not make this any more of a debate, this is my last post for this thread.   God Bless and may your bike run cool, the mud be deep and the tabletops be cleared easily.     Yours in Christ, Jeff+

[trx#9]

www.ethicalatheist.com/docs/religion_and_science.html Can't debate this anyway!

[Thrasher]

It is the belief of people who are saved that people who are not will never truely participate in the joy that comes with being saved, the everyday miracles that are noticed by a believer are what gives them the eyes and ears to notice a non-believer and try to turn them towards their way of life.

Please don't try to hold it against believers for trying to "convert" someone when they find out how wonderful they feel on the "saved" side.

Ask youreself this, how many times have you tried to get a friend who doesn't ride to go riding with you?  It's the same concept,,,,,you know about something wonderful(riding) and they don't yet so you want to show them how great it can be.

Id@

religion is a belief, riding is an activity ..... u cannot make comparisons like that.....

[Chuck_Norris]

     His position. Daniel said, "The Most High rules in the kingdom of men" (Da 4:17 NKJV). That's God's answer to frightening headlines and fear-filled hearts. A late-night TV comedian recently said: "Tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, and now the Avian Flu. Maybe this isn't such a good time to be trying to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance." If God is not in control - who is? The President? The Prime Minister? Nice folks, and no doubt well intentioned, but not good enough if you enjoy the idea of sleeping peacefully in your bed at night. The Psalmist said, "My help cometh from the Lord" (Ps 121:2). Think: if He's Lord over every circumstance, and if He's promised to help us when we call on Him, what do we have to worry about?
      You say, "What about terrorism? The Middle East?" No problem. God had it all on the drawing board before a shot was fired. God moves men and nations like we move pawns in a chess game. Look at modern day Israel. God promised 3,000 years ago: "I will bring back my exiled people Israel; they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them...never again to be uprooted from the land I have given them, says the Lord your God" (Amos 9:14-15 NIV). Still think God's not running the show? He's God, and He's in charge. And one more thing you need to know: "At the Name of Jesus every knee should bow...and...every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father" (Php 2:10-11

[VForcedave]

Chuck_Norris, if the bible is true, I do believe it is, then wouldn't this open discussion amongst all of us be part of his plan as well. If this long discussion, which was really started by a non-believer (yet) could bring one person into his kingdom, than mission accomplished. He works in mysterious ways. I was told in my Christian Walk that you need to question the writings of the bible, investigate, read into the writings, be churched and do not accept the writings just because someone tells you its true. It is a journey, and like all journeys you are going to have good times and not so good times. Its a journey and like all journeys it begins with one step. One single step. You do not just sit at the right side of the Father because soemone told you its so. You have to start the journey one step at a time. I enjoy reading the New Testament. One of my favorites is the book of James.  It taught me how to tame my tongue, I use these different books of the bible as a guide book if you will. There is nothing wrong with that. I am still a sinner as well. We all are, I just hope and pray that when my time comes he will let me allow me into his Kingdom. Have a blessed day, it won't hurt.         

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

Chuck_Norris, if the bible is true, I do believe it is, then wouldn't this open discussion amongst all of us be part of his plan as well. If this long discussion, which was really started by a non-believer (yet) could bring one person into his kingdom, than mission accomplished. He works in mysterious ways. I was told in my Christian Walk that you need to question the writings of the bible, investigate, read into the writings, be churched and do not accept the writings just because someone tells you its true. It is a journey, and like all journeys you are going to have good times and not so good times. Its a journey and like all journeys it begins with one step. One single step. You do not just sit at the right side of the Father because soemone told you its so. You have to start the journey one step at a time. I enjoy reading the New Testament. One of my favorites is the book of James.  It taught me how to tame my tongue, I use these different books of the bible as a guide book if you will. There is nothing wrong with that. I am still a sinner as well. We all are, I just hope and pray that when my time comes he will let me allow me into his Kingdom. Have a blessed day, it won't hurt.         

BIBLE=basic instructions before leaving earth.

[Joedirt]

So this thread has become a recruiting crusade and soap box for believers?



I know Swamp Donkey...I know...lol

[SWAMP_DONKEY]

So this thread has become a recruiting crusade and soap box for believers?



I know Swamp Donkey...I know...lol

wait until you see the pulpit I am building @ RR  and yes you can come  lol

[Chuck_Norris]

My closing statement as already state my DRETH I share his thoughts
VFORCE your are correct, in the journeys. It has its challenges and itis full of enlightenment with each hill and valley

Q#4. it doesnt matter to me what you believe in. i will still ride with you and help you in anyway, what better way for me to show GOD that i want to help.
thank you for not attacking me with your reply, as i hope i did not attack you